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Please Clear this Up for us.....
- Thread starter mxp01
- Start date
mxp01
Platinum Level Sponsor
OK, guys that clears things up. We were getting a hot engine by pulling air out of the engine bay. When we reversed the polarity of the vehicle we neglected to re-wire the fan. We have corrected our error and air is now blowing into the engine bay.
Regarding putting the fan on the inside: We considered it but really found it difficult to fit in place, there did not seem to be enough room. We do have (what I believe) a non-standard radiator, so the space between the pully and the radiator is tight.
MXP
Regarding putting the fan on the inside: We considered it but really found it difficult to fit in place, there did not seem to be enough room. We do have (what I believe) a non-standard radiator, so the space between the pully and the radiator is tight.
MXP
Nickodell
Donation Time
My own solution to this was to remove the fan and remount it the other way round. It fouled the motor casing the first time I tried it, but judicious removal of metal and plastic solved that. Now it moves more air and makes less racket.
You can also buy "pusher" fans designed to go in front of the radiator.
You can also buy "pusher" fans designed to go in front of the radiator.
Jeb Stuart
Platinum Level Sponsor
I have it on the outside pulling air in and through the radiator. I removed the mechanical fan too and installed a thermostat. This works great but the thing is the thermostat has to be set to come on just a tad above normal operating temp. Since I live downtown and drive in stop and go traffic it tends to stay on most of the time now that the weather has warmed up and then runs for 4 or 5 minutes when the car is turned off. This is probably good for the car but I worry that I'll have a dead battery one day. I may reinstall the mechanical fan once the southern summer temps steadly stay in the 90's - for some extra help.
Drnobeam
Donation Time
Here's a picture of two puller fans I installed on the inside. These mount to the left and right of the water pump pulley. I have a pusher that mounts on the front, but these two work so well I removed it. I may put it back on this summer when it gets hot.
I have more pictures of the fans at: http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2637816300099876592micCNd
Regards,
Andy
I have more pictures of the fans at: http://good-times.webshots.com/photo/2637816300099876592micCNd
Regards,
Andy
Attachments
Andy, That's quite an engine bay, looks fantastic !
Tom j
Tom j
Nickodell
Donation Time
That's quite a trial for your battery, probably 400 to 500 watt minutes. I had the same problem, but eliminated it when I installed a battery master switch. When you turn it off, apart from the virtues of fire and theft prevention, it also turns off the fan. There's no more reason for the cooling system to boil after switching off than with a mechanical fan, which also stops when the engine stops.
Jeb Stuart
Platinum Level Sponsor
I'll admit I am not much w/ car electronics. First I wired up my fan from the fuse box so it would go off w/ the ignition. However when I turned off the ignition everything including the motor would stay on a second or two - delayed reaction. This freaked me out and I wired it directly to the battery. Nickodell tell me about the master switch - how does it work and where does the switch go?
alpine_64
Donation Time
If the car is stopped when its hot it can boil after switching the motor off. A nice thing about an elctric fan is that it can cool the motor after its been turned off. Many turbo cars do this.. as do cars with electric water pumps, they run after the motor stops to help with the heat soak. Not as big an issue on an alpine as say a tiger or turbo car.. but i know local members with electric water pumps on alpines and they set them to run a few minutes after shut down, not a bad thing on a summer day after driving in heavyy traffic.
Andy, Very nice engine bay. I have a couple of questions:
1) Are the fans really bolted directly to the radiator? I assume you carefuly placed the holes through the fins and not the tubes. But it seems quite risky. Did you take some extra steps to keep the bolts from touching the tubes?
2) Do the extra pictures show some alternate horn mounts. In some pics it looks like there is a horn on the left side behind your overflow tank, but not a mate on the other side. And on other pics it looks like there is a horn on the right side mounted well back. Are these photos of different configurations or are the angles fooling me?
3)Other than the extra fan mounting holes the radiator looks stock. Is that correct?
4) It appears you have not done anything else to improve cooling other than the fans - not blocked the horn holes, no shrouding. Is that correct?
Thanks,
Tom H
Lakewood also ( but Ohio)
1) Are the fans really bolted directly to the radiator? I assume you carefuly placed the holes through the fins and not the tubes. But it seems quite risky. Did you take some extra steps to keep the bolts from touching the tubes?
2) Do the extra pictures show some alternate horn mounts. In some pics it looks like there is a horn on the left side behind your overflow tank, but not a mate on the other side. And on other pics it looks like there is a horn on the right side mounted well back. Are these photos of different configurations or are the angles fooling me?
3)Other than the extra fan mounting holes the radiator looks stock. Is that correct?
4) It appears you have not done anything else to improve cooling other than the fans - not blocked the horn holes, no shrouding. Is that correct?
Thanks,
Tom H
Lakewood also ( but Ohio)
Ken Ellis
Donation Time
Jeb wrote:
"However when I turned off the ignition everything including the motor would stay on a second or two - delayed reaction."
This is just a guess, but the fans may have been acting as generators for those few seconds, supplying enough 12V for the ignition system to keep working. A relay would solve this, as it would de-energize instantly and disconnect. A relay would also let you use a small capacity time-delay to disconnect after X minutes, or when temp is X degrees. (If you want to change it again...) Your fan manufacturer probably has these and other options that would plug right in.
Ken
"However when I turned off the ignition everything including the motor would stay on a second or two - delayed reaction."
This is just a guess, but the fans may have been acting as generators for those few seconds, supplying enough 12V for the ignition system to keep working. A relay would solve this, as it would de-energize instantly and disconnect. A relay would also let you use a small capacity time-delay to disconnect after X minutes, or when temp is X degrees. (If you want to change it again...) Your fan manufacturer probably has these and other options that would plug right in.
Ken
Drnobeam
Donation Time
Electric Fans
Tom, thanks - labor of love with the engine bay. It really is a daily driver.
The fans are extremely light weight and are mounted with plastic zip fasteners - the kind that comes stock with most electric fans (Hayden for example). It's a quick and cheap method to mount. They are not mounted with bolts. I'm planning to fabricate a mounting a bracket now that I know they do a good job cooling. These fans are from a Honda motorcycle. They are quiet and draw a lot of air. I removed the upper radiator shroud because it's no longer needed without the stock fan. The radiator is a stock Series V. I haven't built a shroud or plugged up any holes.
What is the theory behind plugging the horn holes?
The horns are both stock that I'm aware of. They came with the car when I bought it in 1985. They are a high and low note horns. For a better view of the horns, check out more pictures at:
http://community.webshots.com/user/andydevoe
It was a beautiful weekend cruising with the Sunbeam in Lakewood.
Andy
Tom, thanks - labor of love with the engine bay. It really is a daily driver.
The fans are extremely light weight and are mounted with plastic zip fasteners - the kind that comes stock with most electric fans (Hayden for example). It's a quick and cheap method to mount. They are not mounted with bolts. I'm planning to fabricate a mounting a bracket now that I know they do a good job cooling. These fans are from a Honda motorcycle. They are quiet and draw a lot of air. I removed the upper radiator shroud because it's no longer needed without the stock fan. The radiator is a stock Series V. I haven't built a shroud or plugged up any holes.
What is the theory behind plugging the horn holes?
The horns are both stock that I'm aware of. They came with the car when I bought it in 1985. They are a high and low note horns. For a better view of the horns, check out more pictures at:
http://community.webshots.com/user/andydevoe
It was a beautiful weekend cruising with the Sunbeam in Lakewood.
Andy
Chuck Ingram
Donation Time
The closing of the air horns was mostly for the tigers.The theory is to get more air through the rad therefore better cooling.Also a full shroud to get more air through the rad was benificial.For a stock Alpine which I had a few a good rad shop can rod and clean your rad or recore it with an extra row.The 6 blade Alpine fan is also a good help
Andy, thanks for the extra pics. It's now pretty clear that both horns are there. Obviously the angles fooled me. But it is also clear that some of the pics are of different stages of development of your car. I see in some pics there is no overflow tank and the little shroud on top is still present. I assume those are from before you went to electric fans. I like the family pic!
And I like the idea of using plastic zip fasteners as a temporary mount.
Regarding the horn holes and shroud issues, Chuck is correct that these issues were developed in a study of Tiger cooling. But many of us Alpine owners have had cooling problems as well. I know I've had Alpine cooling problems going back to my first Alpine, a SIV back in 1965. I read on this forum that the radiator recored with a 3 row core seems to solve the problems. But the Tiger study also showed that a significant part of a solution was to be sure that more air got forced through the radiator and that 1 step to that end was to block the large holes in the radiator mounting fascia near the horns. On a SV the horns are actually mounted partway in those holes. This forces more air to go through the radiator rather than around the radiator and through those holes. Additional air flow gains are achieved by the use of shrouds around the fan.
Here's a link to the whole study:
http://www.teae.org/cooling/cooling_article.html
Tom
And I like the idea of using plastic zip fasteners as a temporary mount.
Regarding the horn holes and shroud issues, Chuck is correct that these issues were developed in a study of Tiger cooling. But many of us Alpine owners have had cooling problems as well. I know I've had Alpine cooling problems going back to my first Alpine, a SIV back in 1965. I read on this forum that the radiator recored with a 3 row core seems to solve the problems. But the Tiger study also showed that a significant part of a solution was to be sure that more air got forced through the radiator and that 1 step to that end was to block the large holes in the radiator mounting fascia near the horns. On a SV the horns are actually mounted partway in those holes. This forces more air to go through the radiator rather than around the radiator and through those holes. Additional air flow gains are achieved by the use of shrouds around the fan.
Here's a link to the whole study:
http://www.teae.org/cooling/cooling_article.html
Tom