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Soft top from a S-4 or 5 and Installing on a Series 3 - WON'T FIT

Knightowl61

Knightowl61

Gold Level Sponsor
S-III bought without top or windshield. Installed a windshield and aquired a softtop from a S-4 or 5 (b-post hardware included).

Reading https://forum.sunbeamalpine.org/index.php?threads/soft-top-and-hard-top-alignment.30530/#post-224532
Set windshield to 29.5" , moved bottofront window guide fully forward and top guide adjustment didn't do much. The quarter window to frame looked good with windshield at 30".
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Even at 30+" the back is way off when the top horizontal frame pin is in the windshield receiver.

The hinge arm won't go forward enough to go into the b-post cap and the back edge of th window is way short at the bottom and still short at the top

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Is there a difference in the series III st top frame or b-post linkage? Any ideas on how to put a soft top on this car that fits? ...........Want to go to the invasion.
 

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The tops are interchangeable

The issues is the pivot arms that come out of your B post will have been badly bent back by people forcing them down.

You need to bend them to bring the arm further forward.
 
Also your screen rake is too far back. Get the adjusters from sunbeam specialties or Dan R to adjust the outer screen ruts up and get a even gap to the 4 window
 
Did you grind the padding off the bottom of the dash pad where it goes under the windshield frame? As Michael said, the frame is bent quite a bit. Kinda frustrating, but not insurmountable, you'll get it.
 
junkman said:
Did you grind the padding off the bottom of the dash pad where it goes under the windshield frame? As Michael said, the frame is bent quite a bit. Kinda frustrating, but not insurmountable, you'll get it.
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The dash pad is just moulded plastic, the end that goes under the windshiels is about 1/32" thick.
I thought the windshield was ok, if adjusted over 30" the window to windshield is even. I thought Michael said the pivot arms that come out of the B post were bent.
 
Yes the pivots are bent and will require straightening. One of the ways to stand the windshield up is to trim the front edge of the dash pad under the body to frame gasket. It may be 1/32" but multiply that by 12" to the top of the windshield. Also the adjuster nuts as mentioned replace the rubber wedges that were under the outside ends from the factory. I've never had to use those adjusters as I will use washers between the studs and body. Sunbeam Specialties includes a Tech sheet with the tops they sell regarding straightening the pivots. I'll see if I can dig 1 up and post it here.
 
puff4 said:
Can you make a PDF of that documentation and post it? It would be useful to me, and also perhaps to many others. (Thanks!!)
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It looks like the UK clubs "Alpine guide" I think it was available to saoca members a few years back when the clubs first starting formalising ties
 
When I have had issues like this I have removed the bolt that holds the top onto the hinge. I then positioned the top so that the vertical and horizontal bars are parallel to the edges of the glass, where they need to be, then I've bent the B Post hinge to fit. To me the windscreen looks to be slightly at the wrong angle and the B Post hinges are significantly bent but both issues are fairly easily fixed (even though it is a pain when you are the one doing it).
Tim R
 
Tim R said:
When I have had issues like this I have removed the bolt that holds the top onto the hinge. I then positioned the top so that the vertical and horizontal bars are parallel to the edges of the glass, where they need to be, then I've bent the B Post hinge to fit. To me the windscreen looks to be slightly at the wrong angle and the B Post hinges are significantly bent but both issues are fairly easily fixed (even though it is a pain when you are the one doing it).
Tim R
Click to expand...
This is the best idea. I took everything apart and straightened the bent part, didn't make ane difference. Over bent and a little difference.
 
When you took it all apart and had the top lined up with the window horizontal top and vertical rear was it possible to see how far out the hinge arm was and how much you needed to bend it forward? I don't understand why, if you straightened the bent piece, it didn't solve the problem.

Think of it this way, the front edge of that black hinged section needs to be at or close to the front edge of the slot in the Chrome B post cap. When it is there your soft top will be close to fitting. Get that right and you will be nearly there.
Tim R
 
That B-Post pivot arm is the weakest link in the whole Alpine design. Note that every time you raise the top from its stowed position, you usually pull the top up while gripping it from near the trunk. If the main pivot on the pivot assembly binds at all, the leverage you have from grabbing the frame near the top makes it easy to bend that joint where the vertical part of the frame attaches to that pivot assembly. It bends it up and forward, such that when the horizontal part of the frame anchors into the windshield, the bottom of the vertical part of the frame sets back a bit and the pivot assembly does not move all the way forward, resulting in that gap you see. The whole issue is exaggerated by the multiple opportunities for binding in the pivot assembly during the raising of the top. First of all, the main pivot in the assembly can get rusty and binds, especially as it approaches the near-vertical position, since that pivot rarely gets all the way to, or past, that point. In addition, note that the bolt that hold the frame to that pivot assembly is also a pivot. If that bolt is not free to easily pivot as the top is raised, there will be additional stress to bend the pivot assembly. Furthermore, the B-post casting includes a ramp that guides (forces) the moving part inward as the top is stowed, and a flat spring pushes the moving part outward as the top is raised. Note the total of FIVE sliding or rotating joints that are potential binding pints that can ultimately cause the pivot assembly to get bent out of shape. 1) the main pivot for the arm to rotate up and down 2) the pivot bolt that attaches the vertical frame to the pivot arm 3) the pivot rivet that holds the arm to the main pivot bracket,4) the ramp that forces the pivot in during stowing, and 5) the flat spring pushing the arm outward upon raising. Note also that I have seen several hinge assemblies where the P.O had replaced the bolt that holds the vertical frame part to the hinge assembly with a standard bolt and nut torques tightly so that that point did not pivot at all.

Depending on how badly the assembly is bent, you can often fix it by careful re-bending. The pivot bolt holding the vertical frame to the assembly is often bent. Replace it. be sure to use a nylock nut so it is free to pivot. Most of the bending is of the tab on the pivot arm where the vertical frame pivot bolt attaches. This can usually be re-bent enough using a vice and channel-lock pliers and possibly a torch.

Tom
 
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