Radiator questions

[howard]

While I had my SIV's engine out I went through other major equipment and had them checked- one being the radiator. I was told after having it pressure checked that it was OK. I inquired about having a 3-row core replacement for more efficiency, but the guy said if I was just driving around town, it would not push enough air through to really "do the job."

NOW I'm losing coolant and the temps are elevated (but not steaming) and I suspect the radiator is losing the a/freeze through a split. I've not checked it with a pressure check yet. If it does prove to be the radiator, was the earlier advice credible? Is it worth the extra cash to buy a "new" radiator with the 3-row setup, or should I stick with the original setup?

Not running an electric fan, but until this incident, didn't have problems cooling. The cap is a 7lbs. standard cap. No fluid on the floor... can't see any in the oil.

 

[Jim in PA]

rad mod

Howard,
I feel your pain. My SV always ran hot even in not-so-hot conditions. Last Christmas I pulled my SV rad and sent it to have a 3 row core installed. At the least it would give me better cooling capacity no matter how slight. At best it would increase my cooling capacity by 30-33%...
It would insure a clean core too. Some folks have removed the tank sections to expose the 2 row core to "Rod" the veins. (Push a welding rod through each vein to unblock and clean)
It took a while to find the correct 3 row core but once finished I have very good cooling capacity with a 170F thermostat. (I believe 160F is called for in summer and 180F for winter) My temp gauge almost never gets to 85C except for very slow traffic in very (90- 95F) hot conditions. Keep in mind that pressure check doesn't tell you if the core is clean and free flowing...only that it will hold xxx amount of pressure.
If you live where 95F++ you may consider an electric fan on the rad too just for extreme confidence.
Having the rad recored cost me $245.00 at the local shop. He boiled out, made repairs (solder) and epoxy coated the insides of my fuel tanks and cross tubes for another $45.00.
I'd look at having the 3 row core installed if that mod doesn't sit poorly with you.
Just my feedback on recent one-time experience.
Jim

 

[todd reid]

radiator

Howard,
I would second Jim's advice. I went with a 3 row close to 20 years ago, and consider it money well spent.

 

[Series3Scott]

Agreed. The only thing I didn't have rebuilt during the restoration of my Series 3 years ago was the radiator. It was tested and came back fine. Guess what happened? Started to overheat, which was never a problem before. Had it recored with a 3 row and now it's rock solid at 170 degrees with no electric fan necessary. Worth the $300 or so it will take to do it right.

 

[Alpine Addict]

I agree with re-coring to a 3 row I did this on my series 5 and it make a difference.

I would suggest finding the leak first in case it is not the radiator.

 

[howard]

Excellent advice, Steve. I started the car to let it warm up (and also make some carb adjustments), and when she warmed up the overflow tube began spewing antifreeze. Not just a little- probably a quart or more. The car ran somewhat hot afterwards- but never really dangerously hot. There's definitely NOT a leak in the radiator. What's a spewing overflow hose symptomatic of? Bad cap? Stuck thermostat?

 

[bobw]

Could be a leak in the head gasket.

Bob W.

 

[Tom H]

Or it could be simply a too full radiator! If you fill a SV radiator to the top , it will surely spill out the overflow tube as it warms up and the water expands.

If it continues to overflow even if the top tank is only half full when cold, then you may have a problem like a leaky head gasket.

Tom

 

[Alpine Addict]

I have found it normal for some overflow to come out of the overflow pipe after filling the radiator and running the engine. I assume this is the water adjusting itself to the correct level.

If the car is continuining to overflow then there could be a head gasket problem.

 

[howard]

This is substantially more than an "evening up" of the radiator fluid level. The fluid shoots out the overflow pipe in a pulsating manner, as if the water pump is hooked directly up to it. It continues until it is well below sight in the radiator.

Head gasket, eh? Is this serious stuff, or something an ordinary mortal such as myself can handle?

 

[Jim E]

Howard,
With the car cold take the radiator cap off and the coil wire, fill it with water, hit the key and spin the motor over. See if the water jumps out of the radiator if so you have compression getting into the water jacket and a blown head gasket. You can do this without taking the coil wire off and just start the car but it can make a mess if it spews a lot.

 

[Green67Alpine]

This is substantially more than an "evening up" of the radiator fluid level. The fluid shoots out the overflow pipe in a pulsating manner, as if the water pump is hooked directly up to it. It continues until it is well below sight in the radiator.

Head gasket, eh? Is this serious stuff, or something an ordinary mortal such as myself can handle?

Not that serious of a repair. A bit involved, but really just a procedure.. Even I replaced one. You'll find plenty of threads on here about doing it right !

Tom j

 

[kenny_ii]

I would agree doing a head gasket repair on these cars is not that bad. One caveat however is to make sure you check the block deck for warpage. My SV had almost 5 thousand'ths warpage around #4 cylinder, crossing a coolant passage to the cylinder bore no less. A quick skim at the machine shop along with the head and all is well.

I also had a three row core put in my radiator, even before I ever drove it. The stock two core just didn't seem heavy duty enough for Texas summers to me.

Tim

 

[howard]

I did as Jim suggested, and there was absolutely no spurting. I then started the car and let her warm up. I took the hose that runs to the heater core off, and received a warm shower for my efforts. (I was really trying to determine if there was an air pocket trapped in the line... well, there's not NOW!) I let the car run for probably 25 minutes and she never got overheated or spurted fluid again. The max temp was approx. 180 degrees.

Maybe the thermostat was stuck? I'll drive it to work tomorrow and see if it gets hot again. (Work's not so far away that it would leave me stranded if it were somewhat hot.)

 

[howard]

Still runs hotter than I'd like- around 210 degrees. I believe I'll just replace the thermostat and radiator cap and see if it makes any difference. If not, I may get one of those 3-rowers. I know that would probably make some difference, but my budget needs a break right now.

 

[bobw]

That sound like a good plan Von. One step at a time.

On the head gasket check, I seem to recall that one should let the car warm up with the radiator cap off and look for bubbles in the coolant. The leak might not be big enough to cause spurting, but a smaller leak could still be adding a significant amount of heat into the water causing overheating problems.

Bob W.

 

[Bill Blue]

Are those temps by dash gauge or measured by thermometer? A good rule of thumb is to pay no attention to the dash gauges. They lie.

Bill

 

[RootesRacer]

I had a very nice hipo 3 row done early this summer and found that the temp still runs close to 200F.

My motor is pretty warmed over so your mileage will vary.

I think the larger issue (in my case) is that stock fan doesnt really pull enough air through the radiator as a whole, that is it only pulls from the center and much of the radiator cross section isnt flowing when the car isnt moving.

I myself plan to make a rad shroud to pull flow from all reaches of the core, I figure it will double my stopped cooling capacity.

Car cools just fine at any speed above 20mph.

 

[howard]

The shroud seems like an innovation most Alpines could use. You ought to consider making a few up for others to buy. The engineers did a fair job with this car's design... except when it comes to cooling. I read somewhere that the majority of the air that cools the radiator on the Alpine comes from underneath the car and not through the grille.

 

[65beam]

radiator

bill hit a good point about the guages. they didn't work when they were new. i check with my handheld unit to see what the temp is and have never seen the guage right. in all my years of owning alpines i have had one time that i had an alpine run hot. that was with the red harrington. figured out that i had too much anti freeze in it and not enough water. you need a 50/50 mix. if i'm in traffic and not moving, i turn on the heater for a little extra flow. alpines have never been a car to overheat in stock configuration.i also run 195 thermostats in them.