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Not enough gear

S

Stevesass

Donation Time
I am new to the forum's. Hope someone can help me out. I have a 1967 Alpine series V . On back roads and mountains it runs great. On highways it runs out of gear. It runs about 4600 rpm at about 60 mph. Too high for longer trips. Any suggestion to help this problem ????
Wound tight in PA
Great site !!!!!
 
Barry

Barry

Diamond Level Sponsor
Sounds like two different issues.

First, most S-V Apines have 4.22:1 gears in the rear axle. In combination with typical 22-3/4" tires (~914 revs per mile), that works out to be about 3860 RPM at 60 MPH.

Second, I suspect that you have some tachometer and / or speedometer error. As noted above, you should not be seeing 4,600 RPM at 60 MPH. Having said that, 3860 RPM at 60 MPH is still pretty "buzzy" for highway use.

Lots of Alpines had 3.89:1 gears and that would reduce the RPM at 60 MPH to about 3550. Some people are using 3.70:1 rear gears that would give about 3400 RPM at 60 MPH.

Another solution would be a 5-speed overdrive transmission conversion using a Toyota transmission and a Dellows bellhousing.

Some of the Alpine experts can provide more information.
 
R

RootesRacer

Donation Time
If you can prove that you really are running 4600 RPM in 4th at 60, I once had the exact same issue.

Problem proved to be that someone swapped the differential third member to that of an early hillman minx with a ratio of 4.55/1.
 
Barry

Barry

Diamond Level Sponsor
Anything is possible, but even a 4.55:1 with a 914 rev/mile tire only calculates to be about 4160 RPM at 60 MPH; that is why I suspect a tach or speedometer problem.
 
N

norville

Donation Time
Welcome to the forum. And Pa to boot. that's like 6 of us now?? Raise a wheel spin the tire and count the revolutions on the axle. if it's over 4 you most likely have 4:22's. Maybe have someone follow you at speed or borrow a GPS.

Oh, where is the pic?? where did you get it?? spill the beans man...

bob
 
husky drvr

husky drvr

Platinum Level Sponsor
Barry said:
Anything is possible, but even a 4.55:1 with a 914 rev/mile tire only calculates to be about 4160 RPM at 60 MPH; that is why I suspect a tach or speedometer problem.
Click to expand...

Rootes also had other ratios available to, at least 5.22:1.

Starting from 4.22:1, possible ratios are;

4.44:1, 4.55:1, 4.78:1, 4.86:1, and 5.22:1.

There may be more but these ARE listed in my Hillman service manual. BTW, they are all spiral bevel gear sets EXCEPT 4.22:1 and 4.44:1 which are hypoid gear sets.

I would agree that the tach is probably out of calibration due to the known tendency for electronic component degeneration. There is a possibility the rear gears could be the real problem.

I think I would check the tach reading against a garage's inspection or tune up analyzer machine before getting more involved mechanically.

Just a few thoughts,
 
old grumpy

old grumpy

Donation Time
Laycock de Normanville overdrive

Armand4 said:
Aren't the original overdrive Alpine transmissions fragile, hard to find and expensive?
Click to expand...

No, it will take the Alpine engine power as long as you have the car, I promise confidently. If it is in a good condition. Things do wear out, but they never break down.

Hard to find in US, I don't know. Here in Europe, not that hard. I have 5 on the spare part shelf. Just in case, but I am overdoing it, haven't changed an overdrive yet.
 
T

Tom H

Platinum Level Sponsor
Easiest first step would be to switch to a 3.70 gear set in the diff. That would drop your actual revs from about 3860 to about 3400.

The OD tranny is solid, but not so easy to find in the US. But severel of us have bought rebuilt ones from the UK - figure $1200-1500 incl shipping.

Don't bother looking for an OD to add on to your tranny- the problem is that the swap requires a different mainshaft in the tranny itself.

And I can update and Calibrate your tach next month. Send me an e-mail (not a PM) thayden AT keithley DOT com.

Tom Hayden
 
S

Stevesass

Donation Time
Iwill check the speedo and tach. I have a GPS and a dwell / tach meter. I may be off on the numbers I remember. Are 3.70 gear set available anywhere ???
To Norville:
I found it from a friend of a friend . It was sitting in a garage since 1982. I did a lot of work so far but will never be done ( paint , interior , .....) Here is a pic.
Great help so far . I will keep everyone posted.

2004_0509alpine0010.jpg
 
old grumpy

old grumpy

Donation Time
The easy part is to buy them, the hard part is adjust the gear set properly.
Don't forget the new bearings, the shims and seal.
 
Mikeflbmer

Mikeflbmer

Bronze Level Sponsor
Use 14" Mg Wires

Try getting a couple of 14 inch wires off an MG...Use tallest tire you caN find and run on back, that will help some...I have a spare 389 rear end from Alpine......also have a 4:88 Posi from a Mazda that will bolt right in...anyone need that? I run an OD in one of my Alpines, std 4 speed ion the other....big difference....OD is trouble free so far... Mike
 
todd reid

todd reid

Gold Level Sponsor
Steve,
I had the same problem many years ago. Turned out the tach was reading approx 1,000 rpm high at 60. Ultimately ended up with 3.89 rear + 14 inch wheels before crossing over to the dark side (the ultimate solutuion!).

PS I live in Nazareth and work in Wyomissing.
 
old grumpy

old grumpy

Donation Time
If it was possible to transfer a differential to US I could solve the problem for some of you. I have four leftover 3.7-1, a few 3.8 - 1.
Nobody who has a Atlantic liner??
 
S

Stevesass

Donation Time
Well guys , now I'm really confused.
I jacked up 1 side of the rear and counted the rev's of the drive shaft when I turned the tire 1 rev. I got about 2 1/4 revs ?????????
This made no sense so I tried it on the other side with same result. Then I tried turning the drive shaft instead with same result ?????????
Does this make sense to anyone or am I doing something wrong:confused:
 
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