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Removing engine

Discussion in '"Stock" Alpine' started by clhiller, Nov 8, 2019 at 11:26 AM.

  1. clhiller

    clhiller Silver Level Sponsor

    I am getting ready to remove the engine and tranny from my S1. I have the workshop manual and am pretty confident in the steps required. I'm just wondering where is the best place to attach my engine hoist. I have a tilting device to angle the engine/tranny to get it in and out, but which holes are the best to bolt it to?
    Is it necessary/better to remove the intake manifold before removal? I will be rebuilding the carbs.
     
  2. puff4

    puff4 Gold Level Sponsor

    Here’s where I attached my hoist’s tilt-bar. Some Alpine motors still have the front bracket with the round lift hole, and a lesser few still have the rear bracket on the head stud, but many times these have been discarded.

    [​IMG]
     
  3. puff4

    puff4 Gold Level Sponsor

    As far as the intake and exhaust manifolds, I found it much easier to install it without them, but it can be done with them... there’s just less wiggle-room.
     
  4. Gordon Holsinger

    Gordon Holsinger Platinum Level Sponsor

    I would recommend removing the carbs and manifold for removal of the engine. The front lift eye makes it a lot easier to remove I have a piece of angle iron drilled for mounting on the head stud.
     
  5. clhiller

    clhiller Silver Level Sponsor

    The bolt that holds the front lift ring, is the bolt hole tapped into the block? Is it normally used to hold something else on or is it just for the lifting ring?
    (I am at work right now and can't go look. Sorry)
     
  6. puff4

    puff4 Gold Level Sponsor

    The front lift ring is held on by the lower right stud & nut that secures the cast water outlet to the front of the cylinder head. Here’s mine:

    [​IMG]
     
  7. puff4

    puff4 Gold Level Sponsor

    I would like to know why they drilled that other small hole in that lift bracket, though - does anyone know?
     
  8. 65beam

    65beam Donation Time

    It's a lifting ring that is secured by the bolts that attach the thermostat housing to the head. I've tried lifting the entire engine/trans unit a couple times over the last 50+ years and the bracket has bent. It may work if you're removing the engine only but I don't trust using a bracket secured to the head only. I remove the left rear head bolt and the left 110_0591.JPG front head bolt and secure a piece of chain using these two bolts and I have a secure lifting point secured to the block. This engine has the thermostat housing for a series 2 but the principal is the same.
     
  9. 65beam

    65beam Donation Time

    It could be because some of the other Rootes cars such as sedans used a different thermostat housing and water pump. I think you can see the difference by looking at this photo of one of my other cars. 100_0254.JPG
     
  10. puff4

    puff4 Gold Level Sponsor

    What I'm asking about is the tiny hole below the larger lift hole. What is that for? I don't see it being used in your photo...???

    [​IMG]
     
  11. Tim R

    Tim R Silver Level Sponsor

    Puff4,
    I've seen that bracket fitted with that smaller hole used to secure a clamp that holds the petrol pipe up and away from the engine. This is a photo of the engine on my own Series V after we dropped the engine in last time. It has the bracket at the front around the thermostat housing on the other side of the thermostat housing. This bracket has a bend in it and would hit the rocker cover if it was on the other side. We also use the right-angle bracket at the rear cylinder head stud.

    CLHILLER, we always find that it is a good idea to raise the back of the car up high off the ground on axle stands before taking the engine and gearbox out as it gives a lot more clearance and makes it easier to do.

    P1130563.jpg P1130558.jpg P1130550.jpg
     
  12. puff4

    puff4 Gold Level Sponsor

    Nice photos, Tim. The one you have at the rear of the engine looks like an original bracket, as does the one at the front.

    However, I think you'll find that the front bracket belongs on the right side of the motor, not the left. Here's a photo from a factory Alpine brochure showing the bracket's placement.

    [​IMG]
     
  13. Tim R

    Tim R Silver Level Sponsor

    Puff4,
    I totally agree with you, and from a balance point of view it makes more sense to be fitted there BUT this bracket has a distinct bend in it that was clearly put there deliberately that prevents it from going on the other side. Perhaps it is some kind of aftermarket item and they made a mistake.

    Tim R
     
  14. RootesRooter

    RootesRooter Donation Time

    Personally, I don't trust the forward lift bracket. I have watched one literally break and fall off my running engine with no provocation.
     
  15. jumpinjan

    jumpinjan Gold Level Sponsor

    This one that I made needs NO chains, factory lift brackets and so on. It's very stable and needs no balance adjustment because I worked out all the balanced, hard-point locations. (the pictures are customer cars that I worked on)
    [​IMG][​IMG]
    Jan
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2019 at 5:41 PM
    puff4 likes this.
  16. puff4

    puff4 Gold Level Sponsor

    Very nice! Definitely built-for-purpose.

    How do you get the engine to tilt up (or down) when you need it to, though? I found using an adjustable tilt mechanism with fore and aft mounting points gives good control over such tilt and eases the fiddling, particularly when doing the job without an assistant.
     
  17. alpine_64

    alpine_64 Donation Time

    When i pulled my engine and trans as a unit out the top i used a balance bar for it.... However the front lifting bracket continuously bent.... Think of all the work.cycles that goes through.. Asking for a failure eventually
     
  18. puff4

    puff4 Gold Level Sponsor

    My gosh, Michael, I hope mine doesn’t go through too many more work cycles... I rebuilt that sucker to last! :)
     
  19. 65beam

    65beam Donation Time

    It sounds like everybody has their opinions of what works for them and they are able to remove or install the engine / trans which is the objective. It seems there are some that have had the front bracket bend including me and some haven't. I have several of both brackets stashed in the cabinet if someone wants to buy one. Whether I'm pulling an engine to rebuild or parting out a car I never do the job by myself. One thing Jean and I did back in the 80's was to set up our small shop for working on Sunbeams only. Nothing else fits. We installed a 6" X 12" beam the full width of the garage that allows us to use the system of the rachet hoist and the engine mounted chain. When the kid and I installed the engine / trans in the Harrington a year ago our system allowed us to have the unit set in the car and bolt everything up in about 30 minutes. This included the drive shaft. We don't use a balance bar because we have a small jack that we put under the bell housing and it allows us to move the engine back and also raise the trans into place to install the rear cross member. I know of several shops that use a bracket similar to Jan's for pulling engines. What works for one may not work for others.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2019 at 10:13 AM
  20. hartmandm

    hartmandm Moderator Platinum Level Sponsor

    An FYI if you use chains attached to the engine for lifting. A wide inverted V angle on the chains (i.e. greater than 120 degrees) will work as a force multiplier and you will actually place more force on a single lift point than the actual weight of what is being lifted. Keep the angle as small as possible.

    For more details, see the "Inner angle" section at the bottom of this page.
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anchor_(climbing)

    Mike
     

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