2.8 progress

[Fordtootsie]

MikeH

I am using the Volvo fan that has been recommended with a Al center adaptor plate made local and washers to move the fan forward. The washer combination was miked to make sure that each set of washers - I am using 2 ea - were the same thickness.

John in Colorado

Has anybody looked at there rubber boot to determine its condistion??

 

[MikeH]

MikeH

I am using the Volvo fan that has been recommended with a Al center adaptor plate made local and washers to move the fan forward. The washer combination was miked to make sure that each set of washers - I am using 2 ea - were the same thickness.

John in Colorado

Has anybody looked at there rubber boot to determine its condistion??

Why are you moving the fan forward instead of trimming the blades?

 

[Fordtootsie]

MikeH

I guess I don't have a good answer. I just tried other methods of gaining space. One could trim the fan and gain ever more space.

Another item
Are your ball joints close to exhaust pipe? What is the condition of the rubber boot on the right hand ball joint.


John in Colorado

 

[Fordtootsie]

MikeH

I went out and measured the thickness of the two washers I used. It came out to 0.0125. So I could gain that much it would make the fan clearance around 0.667. I could then modify the dent in the side frame and gain say 0.25 clearance on the ball joint putting it a about 0.20 clearance on the rubber boot.

I will need to think about that --Thanks

John in Colorado

 

[MikeH]

MikeH

I guess I don't have a good answer. I just tried other methods of gaining space. One could trim the fan and gain ever more space.

Another item
Are your ball joints close to exhaust pipe? What is the condition of the rubber boot on the right hand ball joint.


John in Colorado

The only reason I asked about the fan and the spacers is that there is information on trimming the fan blades to clear the engine parts that interfere. Is your fan adaptor flat or does it also push the fan closer to the rad? Here is a link on the site about an adaptor sold by a member and instructions.

http://www.sunbeamalpine.org/index.php?categoryid=90&p2_articleid=24

I can't answer you other question. I don't have the 2.8 in the car.

 

[Fordtootsie]

MikeH

That article was written by Dennis Michaliga and is also accessible from a link from the "Ford 2.8L V6 Alpine Conversion" article on the web. This is a very nice article with everything you need to make the V6 conversation including part numbers for the items required.

My lower rad connection was modified by a club member and cleared the fan from the start so I did not have to go through that step as shown in the fan article.

I looked again at my fan and the trim required to clear the crank pulley. If I trim the fan and remove the spacers I would have to trim each blade the full length of the blade. It would be a straight trim vs a curved trim as in Dennis's article so it might be a easy task.

I have not completed my conversation work so I might go back and trim the fan - I need to think about

John in Colorado

 

[DanR]

Double pulley fan

Here is my set up for an Air Conditioner system on a 2.8 V6 in an Alpine.

I have a dual pulley set up for the A/C and even needed a 3/8" spacer for adequate clearance between the fan and the harmonic balancer which also has dual pulleys.

I still have more than 3/4" between the fan (four blade) and the radiator.

Of course, the Alpine has all of the components I designed for the V6 Conversion

My '67 SV Commodore Blue V6 has not given me any engine heating problems with the four blade fan.

 

[MikeH]

Dan,

It also looks like you are using the stock fan and not the Volvo fan. Could be a difference if length there.

 

[Fordtootsie]

Ser I - 2.8 Conversion Project Update

I posted my Ser I, 2.8 project progress today but not sure I used the best / correct thread.

So I will post the pictures again here. They show the installation of Ser V adjustable seats in my Ser I. The Ser I seats were not angled and did not have adjustable seat backs.

John in Colorado

 

[Fordtootsie]

Series I - 2.8 project update

OK all patch panels are installed and leaded - body filler will be sometime in the future.
All undercoating with lizard skin and interior car sound proofing complete (Boy is that stuff easy to apply)

I am working on wheels - A lot more trouble than I first envisioned.

Rear Wheel
Brake drum flange to outside of fender roll - 6.0 inches
Brake drum flange to edge of leaf spring - 4 3/8 inches
leaving 1 1/2 inch between the outside fender roll - gives (6.0 - 1.5) 4 1/2 inches frontspace
leaving 1/4 inch clearance from the leaf spring - gives (4 3/8 - 1/4) 4 1/8 inches backspace
A total of 8 5/8 inches in which to place a wheel and tire
I plan to use a 205/55R15 or 205/60R14 tire. The 15 inch tire has a dia of 23.88 (with a 3% load factor 23.16)
the 14 tire has a dia of 23.69 (with 3% load factor 22.97)
My speedometer needs a 23 inch dia tire to be correct so that will work
The 205 tire is 8.07 inches in width so that will work

Front Wheel

The face of the hub to the outside edge of the fender roll is 2 3/8 inches (This creates the need for a wheel with a large backspace - which I have not found yet)
The face of the hub to the ball joint is 5 inches
The bump stop will allow for a 25 inch dia tire

A standard 14X7 wheel with a 25mm offset results in - a back space of 3 inches and a front space of (8 - 3) 5 inches
This leaves the tire (5 - 2 3/8) 2 5/8 inches past the edge of the fender roll. DOES NOT LOOK GOOD

To be even with the fender roll I need a 14X7 wheel with a backspace of (8 - 2 3/8 inches) 5 5/8 inches. But the ball joint will only allow 4 3/4 with a 1/4 inch clearance.
The best wheel I have found is 3 3/4 inches backspace which has the wheel 0.87 inches past the fender roll.

I think that the Ser I may have different front end spacing than the other series as other members seem to not have this problem.

Wheel info is requested

John in Colorado

 

[Barry]

John,

You have proven yet again that 7" wide wheels will not fit under the front fenders of a series Alpine with stock fenders and stock front suspension. Keeping 6" wide wheels under the front fenders can be done, but requires that the backspace / offset be just right.

I have not seen anything to suggest that the front fender / suspension dimensions are different between the S-I/II and the S-3/IV/V. You noted that the face of the hub to the outside edge of the fender roll on your S-I is 2-3/8 inches; on my S-V, that dimension is 2-3/8 inches on one side and 2-1/4 inches on the other side. For Alpines, that is pretty close.

A 205 section width tire is OK on a 6 inch wide wheel, so why fight city hall to use 7 inch wide wheels?

HTH

 

[Fordtootsie]

Barry

I did not intend to re-event the wheel - but you are SO right on the 7 inch wheel!

As I am at this stage on my project do you know any brand names of 6 inch wheels with a large backspace?

John in Colorado

 

[Barry]

John,

The offset / backspace numbers are not that strange.

With a 13 x 6 wheel, the maximum backspace is about 4-1/4" which equates to a maximum positive offset of about 20 mm

With a 14 x 6 wheel, the maximum backspace is about 4-1/2" which equates to a maximum positive offset of about 25 mm.

With a 15 x 6 wheel, the maximum backspace is about 4-3/4" which equates to a maximum positive offset of about 30 mm.

There a lot of Alpines and Tigers using "Panasport" style wheels that have the appropriate offset / backspace measurements.

I will send you a PM regarding another approach.

HTH

 

[DanR]

I am running 7 INCH rims with P195 55 15 tires.

I "do not have clearance problems nor do my wheels "stick out the sides of my fenders / wings.
The last picture is a shot straight down of the front fender.

Fourth picture has wheel slightly in a left degree, it is not straight.

 

[greenbean]

I like that look pf the tire/wheel assembly!!

 

[Barry]

Who will be the first to claim using 8" wide wheels and 255 section width tires with stock front suspension and keeping everything under stock front fenders?

 

[Fordtootsie]

Barry

Thanks for the help. You have saved me a lot of time.

John in Colorado

 

[PROCRAFT]

"We started out to run an 8" rear wheel and the tires we finally found the tire guys refused to mount on the 8" wheel something about Yoko Ono only allowing to mount on a 7" wheel MAX! so were at 7s all around with 205 55 rears and 195 55 fronts gives us about 8.5& 7.5 widths I wanted a 225 rear but couldn't find a matching set so to speak. the track width is 50.250" in the rear and 51.0 in the front back space is 4.0 all around we've got about .50 built in rake with these tires just something else!!

 

[Barry]

Tire manufacturers publish the minimum, maximum and recommended rim width for every DOT approved tire based on in-house engineering and extensive testing.

For liability reasons, more and more tire mounters / retailers will not install tires on wheels that are narrower or wider than specified by the tire makers.

 

[Barry]

Barry

Thanks for the help. You have saved me a lot of time.

John in Colorado

John,

Glad to help and hope it works out for you.

The unfortunate fact is that it is only about 7" horizontally from the outer ends of the stock upper A-arms on the stock suspension to the outer edges of the stock fender lips at the top of the arch on a Series 3/IV/V Alpine or Tiger at ride height.

With stock spindles and less than 16" wheels, the wheel and tire has to go completely outside the outer ends of the upper A-arms. Including the bead lips, a 7 inch rim width wheel is actually about 8" wide. The actual cross section width of a 195 or 205 section width tire is also about 8" when mounted on a 7" wide wheel.

Don't see any way to put an 8" actual width wheel or tire under a fender that only extends 7" beyond the outer end of the upper A-arm. Tire tread maybe, but certainly not the wheel or tire sidewall.