"floaty" steering

[Ron67Alpine]

So, I've recently replaced tie rod ends, upper and lower ball joints and replaced tortion bar bushings. When I was finished it was pretty obvious I needed an alignment. Took it to the shop the other day for the alignment and I seemed to want to wander in my lane, seem always needing to correct. I figured it was alignment. I've put a few miles on her since then and it still feels "floaty" and wants to wander...wallow is a word that comes to mind, like an old Caddy w/bad power steering and shot shocks. I can remove my hands from the wheel @30-40 mph and she tracks straight. Also getting some vibration, on the steering wheel, @ higher speeds. I've never had the wheels, on car, balanced, but it was never a problem because it steered like a truck w/o power steering. During the rebuild I'm sure I banged and pounded on various parts of the steering mechanism, while removing tie rod ends and such. A-arm was removed and reinstalled, shocks were removed at bottom and loosened at top. Shocks (Monroe) have less than 4K mi on them. I'm gonna go back under and see if everything I replaced is still torqued right, but anyone have any other thoughts? Anything I might have missed?
Thanks
Ron

 

[Toyanvil]

I would check the front wheel bearing adjustment and recheck toe-in should be 1/8" and did you replace the center rod?

 

[albeam]

Ron


Do your lower ball joints have a grease nipple fitted.
I am no authroity on this but my car used to wander
after much fromt end work. some pumped in grease
tranformed the steering. the later cars did away with
the greasing option and some replacement parts probably
do not give you that option. I think the early cars had the
greasing option and it was probably the way to go.

Albeam

 

[Bill Blue]

Recheck the alignment. My car was pretty much like yours. The alignment was terrible. A lot of negative camber and toe out. That was with a fresh alignment! Also, check the camber. There is no real adjustment, just an aluminum wedge between the front cross member and frame. But the aluminum has a way of disappearing over the years.

Camber is easily checked with a carpenters square. Park the car on a flat surface. The wheels should be nearly 90 degrees to the road when measured at the sidewall. Plus or minus about an eighth of inch. It is important they both be the same. There is no easy way to measure castor. If the wedges are intact it is probably okay.

Bill

 

[65sunbeam]

Probably not the problem but make sure the front crossmember to chassis mounting bolts are tight. I had a Tiger with funny steering and it turns out all four of those bolts were loose! You didn't mention the tires but a bad tire will cause problems too. Eric

 

[Ron67Alpine]

Thanks for the replies and suggestions, guys.
I did not replace the center rod, tires are new, less than 4Kmi. I do have grease nipples, on the ball joints, and all have been loaded.
These are the same guys that did the alignment 2yrs ago, when I got her on the road. I asked them if they needed the specs, but said they didn't need them. The replacement repair was occasioned on loosing a lower ball joint, at low speed.
I didn't know it was that easy to check camber. Is there an easy way of checking toe-in?
Which is which? Is toe in determined by tie rod adj and camber is determined by shims between frame and A-arm? Or reverse or I'm not even close?
How about top shock adj or tighten?
Again thanks for the replies,
Ron

 

[Ken Ellis]

They need specs; they just don't know it.
There's a whole section in the manual regarding alignment, starting with rear suspension "jigs" and weight loading. (The jigs are easy to make out of wood.) Now, whether they'll be open to you guiding them through it is another matter.

 

[Bill Blue]

Ken, lets face it, the factory method of alignment is the opposite of brain surgery with an ax. I guess that would cutting down a tree with a scalpel.

It seems that symmetry is the most important thing. Three degrees castor, one degree positive camber and 1/8" toe seems to work most of the time. Set the camber (yes, the one that adjusts with shims) to with the top of the wheel setting out slightly when measured with a square.

Toe is set with the adjustable rods. Measurement is simple in concept, but awkward to implement. Raise a front wheel off the ground. Rotate the wheel while holding a scratch awl against the tread area of the tire. Select an area that will produce a continuous mark around the tire. Repeat on the opposite tire. Lower the front of the car and measure the distance between the marks on the front of the tires. Compare to the distance between the marks at the rear of the tires. The difference is the amount of toe, either in or out. As you can guess, holding the awl steady and taking the measurements is the challenge.

Your question about the top of the shock, I assume you are asking how tight is tight. I tighten until the rubber bushings have a visible bulge.

We need to keep in mind that driving an Alpine is nothing like driving a modern, FWD car with power steering. Totally different feel.

Bill

 

[socorob]

I took my car to get an alignment last week. I showed te guy the manual and said its probably a little different than most cars. He said no problem, hes been doing this for 30 years +. Well after waiting an hour and a half to get to my car, then an hour or so for him to put it on the machine, hook it up and get the toe set, he called me over. He said I had different amounts of camber on each front tire. Then he said this looks different from any car he's ever done. I said yes, that's why I brought the manual and showed you up front. He then says he's not doing it like in the book, he's never seen one done that way before and not about to do one like that now. Long story short, things were getting "tense" and before it got ugly I let him put the car back together. He then says I set the toe. My dad has one of those harbor freight toe gauges, I could have done that myself. In the end he didn't charge me for setting the toe after me being there 3-4 hours, so at least he made things right.

 

[Toyanvil]

Check the center rod, just look at the ends and have someone turn the steering wheel back and forth. If there is free play Rick at SS has bushing for it. I would also check the relay arm at the same time.