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First start problems

H

howard

Donation Time
I've had the engine rebuilt, replaced the starter, battery, oil and most everything else I could think to replace in the hopes of getting this thing on the road. Yesterday I attempted to start the engine, but had no cranking success. I gave up when the starter just gave me clicking noises. It was REAL hot to the touch, so even though it's new I figured it was the problem. The engine was very stiff when it did manage to turn... then nothing. I'm in the process of removing and replacing the starter again, but if someone else can state something I missed, it may help get this thing on the road.

Is it possible the starter is cranking the wrong direction, given this is a positive ground car?

:(
 
Wombat

Wombat

Donation Time
Von

Starter motors go the same way regardless of positive or negative earth. This is because they use a wound field that reverses in polarity along with the armature if the current goes the other way through them. When you get the starter out, make sure it turns freely and that the brushes haven't shorted to the case. You could hook the starter motor up to a battery with some jumper leads to see if it will work out of the car. Hold it down so it doesn't get away from you.

You may also want to take the spark plugs out and see if the engine will turn by hand.

Good Luck
 
64beam

64beam

Donation Time
Hi Von,

I did something similar with my starter motor myself. I kept cranking the engine when I had some issues and got that hot that it melted the solder on the commutator segments. They can be repaired, but I won't do it again. If your ignition system, battery, fuel system and starter are all ok, then you may have a mechanical issue. If you remove the spark plugs is it still hard to turn by hand?

Regards, Robin.
 
tony perrett

tony perrett

Gold Level Sponsor
At the risk of stating the obvious, check that you have a good earth connection between the engine and the chassis.
 
jumpinjan

jumpinjan

Bronze Level Sponsor
howard said:
I've had the engine rebuilt.... I gave up when the starter just gave me clicking noises. It was REAL hot to the touch, so even though it's new I figured it was the problem.
Click to expand...
Check the engine, that looks like the problem, not the starter.
 
H

howard

Donation Time
64beam said:
If you remove the spark plugs is it still hard to turn by hand?
Click to expand...

I removed the plugs and it's pretty much impossible to hand-turn the crank pulley. Is it suppose to be loose enough to turn by hand? I know it CAN be turned (with, apparently, much force) by the starter, but never more than one revolution. I'm getting a sick feeling here...
 
65beam

65beam

Donation Time
start problems

this happened to me in december .i pulled the motor in my series 4 to seal leaks and decided to change the bearings .i installed the mains and everything was ok .turned easy. i installed the rod bearings and when torqued down, the motor would not turn. as it turned out the rod bearings were not what the box said.they were the wrong size and were too tight to allow the crank to turn .
 
64beam

64beam

Donation Time
Hi Von,

Sorry to hear about the bad news :( . Did you rebuild your engine or was it done by someone else? I can only imagine your frustration right now. Hopefully it is rectified quickly so you can get out on the roads and enjoy warmer times.

Regards, Robin.
 
H

howard

Donation Time
I don't have the know-how and tools to do the engine work myself, so I took it to a machine shop that was highly regarded. (I can figure out most everything else on this car, but engine work is extremely delicate IMO.)

I'm going to have to do something about this soon. I didn't buy this car to sit and rot (and pay thousands of dollars for parts and labor). I'd say, "OK- back to it, then!" and roll up my sleeves and yank the engine again, but I no longer have access to a hoist! This may require some sortin' out!
 
B

Bill Blue

Platinum Level Sponsor
Howard, it should be difficult to hand turn the crank pulley, even with the plugs out. The rings create considerable friction. However, you should be able to turn the engine over by pulling on the fan blade or by putting the tranny in 4th gear and pushing the car.

Bill
 
H

howard

Donation Time
I can easily move the fan- but that's only moving the water pump, isn't it? And the tranny is an automatic which has been drained and reinstalled, so it has NO effect at present.
 
T

Tom H

Platinum Level Sponsor
Howard, How far from the machine shop are you? I'd suggest trying somehow to let the machine shop take a look at it before you pull it. Maybe they will see the problem.

Tom
 
H

howard

Donation Time
I was borrowing a hoist from a guy because I really don't have a place to store one when I'm through with this project. He needed it back when I finished with it... I foolishly thought I was done. Yes, we do have a HFreight. I may have to buy one just for this. But I may see if Tom's suggestion will be more workable (and fair) and see if the machine shop would be willing to look at it before removing it. I haven't called them yet, but they may be willing to at least look at it.
 
B

Bill Blue

Platinum Level Sponsor
Howard, I'd go slow on removing the engine. You say you hear just clicking nosies when you turn the key. You should also hear the starter engage the flywheel. This would be a click plus a mechanical sound. If not, there is something wrong in the starter.

If the fan belt has not been put on the engine or is loose, then you are simply turning the water pump when you move the fan. If the belt has been installed and properly tightened, you should be able to turn the engine over. This can be easily verified by looking at the crank pulley as you move the fan blade.

Bill
 
H

howard

Donation Time
When the fanbelt is tight I can barely move the fan/belt, but the crank pulley stays still. The pulley will not move. I fear I may have burned the starter out trying to turn the engine. I'm still going to pull it and check it, but it's just SO HARD to turn the motor. I had someone suggest maybe a stuck valve is causing this and that I should get a breaker bar and work the engine back and forth to unstick it.

NO ROPE was involved in the making of this catastrophe!:D
 
B

Bill Blue

Platinum Level Sponsor
Remove the starter, then try to move the engine with the fan blade. It is possible the starter is stuck. It has happened before to others. Do not use anymore leverage than the fan blade to unstick the engine. If it is stuck that tight, it needs to be disassembled and the problem corrected.

Bill
 
W

wframe

Donation Time
I would definitely contact the machine shop that did the rebuild on the engine. While they did not remove or install the engine, short of a stuck/lock starter, it sure sounds like an assembly problem. If they have the reputation of being a good shop they should stand behind their work.

Good luck. I'm sure this is a real bummer! :(
 
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