Bit of Trivia

[skywords]

My son put in the movie "The Right Stuff" tonight and I have not seen it in eons. The scenes at Pancho Barns Bar the old man with the hat is actually Chuck Yeager. I never noticed that before. I wonder why my good friend Gene Rudolf never pointed that out for he was the Art Director for that movie. Gene is a member of the British Car Club here in Tucson and also a pilot and aircraft owner. I should be ashamed for I am not a member yet. Gene has a beautifully restored Jag.

Rick

 

[Nickodell]

I only saw the movie once; found it a bit too long and melodramatic myself, so it wasn't one of my favorites that I've looked at several times. However, if it ever comes on TV I'll look out for that. If I recall correctly, didn't Chuck have "more than perfect" eyesight; something like 40 over 20, which allowed him to spot enemy aircraft when they were like a speck of dust on the windshield, and even in his late 70s had better than 30:20?

Look out Rick, we've drifted back into planes!!

 

[weaselkeeper]

For my life, I can't figure out what's wrong with drifting into planes.

There I was, out of airspeed and ideas.....

 

[Nickodell]

Upside down, hanging in my straps, zero feet

Now you've done it!


Rules Of The Air
1. Takeoffs are optional. Landing is mandatory.
2. If you push the stick forward, the houses get bigger. If you pull stick back, they get smaller. That is unless you keep pulling the stick all the way back, then they get bigger again.
3. Flying isn't dangerous. Crashing is dangerous.
4. It's always better to be down here wishing you were up there than up there wishing you were down here.
5. The ONLY time you have too much fuel is when you're on fire.
6. The propeller is just a big fan in front of the plane used to keep the pilot cool. When it stops, you can actually watch the pilot start sweating.
7. There are three simple rules for making a smooth landing. Unfortunately no one knows what they are.
8. A 'fair' landing is one where they can use the plane again. A ‘good' landing is one from which you can walk away. A 'great landing is when your passengers agree to fly with you again.
9. Learn from the mistakes of others. You won't live long enough to make all of them yourself.
10. You know you've landed with the wheels up if it takes full power to taxi to the ramp.
11. The probability of survival is inversely proportional to the angle of arrival. Large angle of arrival (positive or negative); small probability of survival and vice versa.
12. Never let an aircraft take you somewhere your brain didn't get to five minutes earlier.
13. Stay out of clouds. The silver lining everyone keeps talking about might be another airplane going in the opposite direction. Reliable sources also report that mountains have been known to hide out in clouds.
14. Always try to keep the number of landings you make equal to the number of take offs you've made.
15. When in doubt, hold on to your altitude. No one has ever collided with the sky.
16. You start with a bag full of luck and an empty bag of experience. The trick is to fill the latter before you empty the former.
17. Helicopters can't fly; they're just so ugly the earth repels them.
18. If all you can see out of the windshield is ground that's going round and round and all you can hear is commotion coming from the passenger compartment, things are not at all as they should be.
19. In the ongoing battle between objects made of aluminum going hundreds of miles per hour and the ground going zero miles per hour, the ground has yet to lose.
20. Good judgment comes from experience. Unfortunately, experience usually comes from bad judgment.
21. If in doubt, try to keep the pointy end going forward, the shiny side up, and the oily side down.
22. Keep looking around before takeoff. There's always something you've missed.
23. Gravity is not just a good idea; it's the law. And it's not subject to repeal. Or appeal.
24. A weather forecast for your destination is a horoscope with numbers
25. No aircraft is ever impressed with your experience. It just doesn't care.
26. The likelihood of brake or flaps trouble is inversely proportional to runway length.
27. It is always better to touch down too far down a short runway, and possibly collide with something at the end when you are down and going slow, than touch down too soon, and crash into something before the threshold when you’re going fast
28. The depth of the part of the engine bay where small parts fall is equal to the exact length of your arm, plus one inch
29. The two most dangerous words in flying are: "watch this!"
30. The four most useless things to a pilot are: altitude above you, runway behind you, fuel in the tanks on the ground, and a tenth of a second ago.

 

[skywords]

I have a couple of employees at another airport disassembling four Starships for demating and transport. I paid them a visit and this airport has a seperate area where they turn surplus fighter jets into statues for their museum. I was thrilled to see a 105 sitting on it's feet. Man that's a big bird! I have a friend that flew them in Nam. Punched out twice once in Nam and the other over Edwards. Broke his back over Edwards. He is die hard Air Force and used to make fun of the Navy. Always said they would have to go on bombing runs to finish what the Navy started. He said the Navy bomb craters looked so tiny because they couldn't carry any weight off the ships. I myself have great respect for Navy and Air Force pilots. The 105 was able to carry nukes. I am not sure if one ever did maybe you would know Pete? Man what a machine it looks like it's traveling 900mph standing still.

 

[Pumpkin]

Those pesky planes

Just a couple of thoughts, Isn't that photo of the 105- 64' not production version? Seems that they had a larger tail and the arrestor hook was ??concealed?
And never forget "an aircraft is no more than a bunch of spare parts, flying in formation, and a pilot no matter of what quality can messem up every time"


USAF 360 th Fighter Interceptor Group, 377 CAMRON . Portland International 1960 1965. The Flying Rock, F-102 Tail numbers 0-61360/ 0-61468, with out acceration river bait and the speedster T-33 Tail number 0-35959.
Note all shiney parts are done with NEVER DULL.

Cheers and thanks to the "VETS" past and present.
Chuck

 

[skywords]

USAF 360 th Fighter Interceptor Group, 377 CAMRON . Portland International 1960 1965. The Flying Rock, F-102 Tail numbers 0-61360/ 0-61468, with out acceration river bait and the speedster T-33 Tail number 0-35959.
Note all shiney parts are done with NEVER DULL.

Did some of those 102's go to the gaurd at Klamath Falls? If so they were always passing me on the down wind and scaring the crap out of me. I was flying a Piper Colt there with a student license around 1979. 14,000 ft of runway in a colt was plenty. The 102's were glad to have it I'm sure.

 

[Bill Blue]

Rick, with 14,000 ft, how many touch and go's could you do before you ran out of runway?

Bill

 

[Pumpkin]

102s'

Did some of those 102's go to the gaurd at Klamath Falls? If so they were always passing me on the down wind and scaring the crap out of me. I was flying a Piper Colt there with a student license around 1979. 14,000 ft of runway in a colt was plenty. The 102's were glad to have it I'm sure.

Yep, the guard then took every thing, the city of portland didn't want the AF any more in the area. Then the guard in Portland got 106's. Don't think about a Piper down wind of a blowtorch....
Cheers
chuck

 

[skywords]

Rick, with 14,000 ft, how many touch and go's could you do before you ran out of runway?

Bill

I often wanted to try and see but the gaurd was always coming up my six, plus I was just soloing and did not want to push my luck. Our family owned a 5000' grass strip northeast of Mt. Shasta and I took an unauthorized trip there in the Colt I was renting. Did not get away with it. I think the mud on the tires was my instructors first clue.

Chuck were you performing maintenance on the 102? Or were you flying them? Either way it must have been a hoot to be involved with them.

Those Convairs were sure beautiful when they would go by. Made you feel like you were standing still. And the noise would drown out the sound of the Lycoming O-235.

 

[Nickodell]

Rick; I can top that (I think). Got lost on my first solo. Was so thrilled to be up there alone, in total control P.I.C! of the Chipmunk that I got carried away (literally) as I practiced turns and a few more things that were unauthorized, not noticing the wind was drifting me way downwind until I realized that I had no idea where the airfield was. Simple: Conduct a square search. After 15 minutes of this I found the field again. Except it wasn't the departure field. I wonder how many others have been so dumb as to "L.O.B." (Landed off Base in RAF lingo) on their first solo. Not many, I think.

The ATC at the landing field wouldn't let me take off again (I wonder why?) so, to add to my humiliation, I had to wait while an instructor was driven over to fly us both back. My log book, which I still have, records "Solo. Not Successful. L.O.B." followed by the CFI endorsement "4 more hours dual before next solo." Oh the shame of it.

 

[skywords]

Wow! to solo in a Chippy is an acomplishment in of itself. I have worked on a couple Chippy's and I recall the tailwheel is not steerable nor locking? Your story reminds me of a flight I had in my Ultralight one day. About 5 pm I took off from the airport Byron Ca. There was a low ceiling with some holes in it so being the brave adventurous type I climbed up through one, certain I would simply fly over to another and decend down through that one. What I did'nt forsee was the wind on top was blowing the perverbial hurricane. I was on a southern heading and it took forever to reach the hole I was to decend through. When I finally reached it it was getting dark and I could see many cars with headlights on I was over a busy city. I should have been over country side like where our airport is located. Having no choice but to circle down through I was shock to see while I was flying on a south heading I had actually traveled very far north off course, I was over Antioch and to make matters worse I had my tinted goggles on and it was raining. This airplane has no windshield and the rain was like bullets. By the time I worked my way back at a low altitude it was very dark and Byron had no runway lights so I lined up the budweiser sign at the restraunt and an outside light on one of the hangers knowing it would put me close to a runway I was able to land. I recieved a real ass chewing from all my buddies upon shutdown.

Nick do you have any pics from the Chipmunk days? It is a real favorite. The ones I worked were modified with big Lycoming engines. I developed a fix for their cracking center sections. The Pepsi chipmunk is one I did. I can post some pics if you like. My prefered Chipmunk would be stock. I noticed they are providing some support for the English ones.

http://www.dhsupport.com/types/dhc1mk21.htm

 

[Pumpkin]

102's

I often wanted to try and see but the gaurd was always coming up my six, plus I was just soloing and did not want to push my luck. Our family owned a 5000' grass strip northeast of Mt. Shasta and I took an unauthorized trip there in the Colt I was renting. Did not get away with it. I think the mud on the tires was my instructors first clue.

>>That would have been sooo cool!!

Chuck were you performing maintenance on the 102? Or were you flying them? Either way it must have been a hoot to be involved with them.

>> They called us supersonic gas station attendants, but I worked on the "duces" and the T birds both, Both fun and somewhat crazy too. And as Nikodell posted, the parts were always just an inch away from recovery, the starter was a one man job, 90 pounds of awkward unit at arms lenght.

Some fun. We did have some narrows some bads, and alot of successes' . Also the 1962 World Champs at "The William Tell" rocket and missile meet in Florida,, wheeweww what a party after that win.
Well nuff for now.
BY
chuck

 

[Nickodell]

Wow! to solo in a Chippy is an acomplishment in of itself. I have worked on a couple Chippy's and I recall the tailwheel is not steerable nor locking? Nick do you have any pics from the Chipmunk days? It is a real favorite.

Unfortunately, almost all my RAF photos were lost in one of our many moves since coming to the States, except for a few on my last H-P Victor station at Gaydon, which I have posted before. I had a collection of color slides, too, but they got ruined by storing them in a damp crawl space, where mold and fungus ate all the gelatin. I had some neat air-to-air ones with the usual grin through the side window, taken by my Best Man (later killed).

The Chippy was the RAF's standard primary trainer right up to the era of the Provost, and later Jet Provost; it took over from the Tiger Moth. Quite easy to fly - tail up at about 35 kts, off the ground at 60. No vices. The tailwheel wasn't a problem, all you needed was a little brake and rudder until the tail came up. The 145hp Gypsy engine sounds a bit anemic, but there was enough spare power to tow air-launch gliders and sailplanes. The only problem I recall was one of my buddies had the crankshaft break during a cross-country but landed in a meadow OK.

One of the good things during my hitch was that the RAF instituted a mandatory sports afternoon every Wednesday for everyone not on essential duties, and while the others were relegated to gruesome and disgusting stuff like cross-country running, a bunch of us with a friends at station HQ got onto the very desirable pilot training list. Getting your PPL free can't be beat. I understand that they don't do that anymore, resulting in the bizarre situation that a guy might have his license to fly supersonic military jets while not being legally licensed to fly a light civilian plane. I remember Prince Andrew, who you may recall flew helicopters in combat in the Falklands War, remarking on TV when his (then) wife Fergie got her helicopter license that she could now fly civilian choppers and take him as a passenger, but he, with all his RN time off carriers couldn't legally fly one.

That experience of yours flying an ultralight through clouds at night makes my a****le pucker like mad just thinking about it. Were you in a "tired of life" mood at the time?

 

[weaselkeeper]

That F105 picuture brings tears to my eyes. My first duty station was Nellis AFB outside Las Vegas. They still had F105s on the ramp and while I was assigned to F-111s, I REALLY wanted to be hangin around the "Thuds". I guess it was the manly nature that they installed the drag chute above the exhause nozzles by jumping up and down on the door until it locked shut. F-105Gs. were two seat versions modified for Electoinc Warfare and became known as Wild Weasels, although F-100s, were doing that mission prior (Skyspot). They went to Guard Units not long afterwards, but we still saw them during Red Flags. The Afterburners lit with a very loud BANG as the ABs weren't lit in stages as they have been since. Nothing like 12 Thuds taking of in two ships, 20 second apart just before sunrise.... goosebumps.

Anyway.... I can't say anyone ever did carry a nuke, but that's what they were designed for. One tactic was the "loft"... Low altitude, speed of heat, pitch up near the target, and release the bomb on speed and altitude lofting the Nuke toward the target....continue the pull thru inverted and haul A** outta there... BTW, it was likely a one way mission as tankers weren't going to follow and the theory was, through mutually assured destruction, there wouldn't be an airfield to come back to anyway....

I got to pet a few F-102 and F-106s, but not turn a wrench. .. awesome jets.

Lastly on F105s... Check out the Book "Going Downtown" by Jack Broughton. He was a Thud driver over North Viet Nam. True story, great action, but the real value in the book is his descrption of the political irritation he faced having to overfly SA2s being offloaded and not being able to attack them because they weren't on the approved target list. Some of those same missles would whack his friends later... I won't give anything more away, but a great book if your interested in that stuff.

Maybe we should put a whole separate airplane section on this forum....but then again, I wouldn't get anything else done. Never mind.

 

[Nickodell]

Thud Ridge by the same author is also a great read. Still available from Amazon too.

There was a good program on "Dog Fight" on TV a couple of weeks ago about the Thuds. The MIGs used to come up and shoot a lot of them down because they were nowhere near as manoeuverable. The MIG drivers just waited until they heard the characteristic radio messages among the Thuds, then come up. The USAF finally adopted the tactic of flying F4s over instead, but using all the same call signs and other radio chatter of the Thuds, and the first time the MIGs came up expecting "easy pickins" they lost 60% of their numbers. After that they were a lot less eager.

Incidentally, a good Chipmunk, with lots of hours BMOH goes for around $100,000 today. I guess you pays for what you gets, seing as how the Chippie is fully aerobatic. Rick, here's one of the Lycoming conversions you mentioned. That extra 100hp can't hurt.

Among the tens of thousands of pilots who trained in or flew the Chipmunk for pleasure was veteran aerobatic and movie pilot Art Scholl, whom the picture shows. He flew his Pennzoil Special at airshows around the country throughout the 1970s and early 1980s, thrilling audiences with skill and showmanship, and proving that the design itself was a top-notch aircraft. Sadly, he was killed in the making of the movie Top Gun flying a Pitts Special.

 

[skywords]

Nice picture of Scholl I have been lucky enough to have seen him performe twice, once at the Reno Air Races and once at Livermore Ca. which I believe was his last performance on a Saturday and Monday he was killed. I would love to have met him. Here are some pictures of the Pepsi Chippie I installed my center section mod in. The parts on the table are the repair parts we fab and install/ the beam is the lower carry thru that we fabricate from solid 4130 steel replacing the aluminum beam. You can see the frames that crack because of the beam flexing.

 

[Nickodell]

Rick - awesome what you do!! The picture of the fractured beam makes the blood curdle. I can almost hear "so that's why the rivets keep popping!" At least we used to wear the old T28 seat chute, so I suppose if a wing had folded I might have joined the Caterpillar Club (founded in 1919 by Leslie Irvin, the real inventor of the practical parachute, and open to anyone whose life is saved by "hitting the silk.")

That was one benefit of the Mosquito - wooden spars so no chance of fatigue cracks. Termites, perhaps.

On the subject of bailing out, a good read is Escape to Danger by Paul Brickhill, who also wrote, among others, Reach for the Sky (about the legless WWII ace Douglas Bader), The Great Escape and The Dam Busters. It details every person who has had the verified experience of bailing out of an aircraft without a parachute - and lived!

An example was a Lancaster rear gunner who couldn't reach his 'chute with the aircraft on fire, and chose to make a quick end by jumping. Half an hour later he awoke to find himself looking at the night sky from inside a deep snowdrift. He had landed in some fir trees that had slowed his descent, and the drift finished his cushioned landing. He was only slightly stunned. The German officer in charge of the squad that picked him up wrote an affidavit (illustrated in the book) that they had searched throroughly, and no parachute had turned up.

 

[skywords]

I've heard stories of people that lived after bailing out with no chute. I even heard the German's tried putting there troops on the wing of a Junkers and letting them slide off at low altitude (very low) into the deep snow, Don't know how true that is? But for someone to survive impacting at terminal velosity is nothing short of a miracle. People are killed nowadays with fully inflated canopies. Most of the time it is stupidity (low hook turn with a high performance canopy = death or serious injury) I had a canopy snivle through 1500' and the ground was coming up at an alarming rate (my stupidity). They say the horizon takes on a dish shape below 1000' at terminal. I never want to find out.

We have a couple of stock Chipmunks that fly down to our airport from the Phoenix area once in a while. They say they have never had any cracking problem with their airplanes in the center carry thru. I sent a letter about the problem to every registered Chipmunk owner in the US when we found the first one. Several owners called me and said they found cracks. All were modified Chippies with the larger powerplants. I had heard that Art Scholl had the same problem with his airplane and had addressed it some manner but I was never able to find out how. Another problem we ran into was the wing attach bolts were corroded and were special DeHaviland bolts. And you guessed it the English bolts are different from the Canadian bolts. And impossible to obtain. So I reamed the holes as I remember .008 larger and installed NAS high strenght bolts that were .750 in diameter and easily procured. It took nerves of steel to ream the fittings for a goof up meant I just bought a wing. It was done with a hand held 1/2" chuck slow turning airdrill. Oh and done with no drill guide using only the pilot shank of the reamer as a guide.
Anyway I sure love Chipmunks.