Adjusting Self-Adjusting Brakes

[Mike Armstrong]

The Alpine might have used springs from the master cylinders stock. You may have to drill the pedal arm and attach like most other cars.

Nice pic, thank you buddy. Looks like I have a trip to True Value in my future (having a True Value down the street has been a God-send. I have rarely left there dissapointed).

 

[Mike Armstrong]

One thing that might be taking place with my brakes is if the brake pedal is not fully returning then I might not be getting a full stroke out of the master.

 

[260Alpine]

Mike, after you do the springs make sure you have some free play at the master pushrod too. Just a little slack is necessary, about 1/4" at pedal.

 

[Mike Armstrong]

Mike, after you do the springs make sure you have some free play at the master pushrod too. Just a little slack is necessary, about 1/4" at pedal.

Thanks.

Do you mean a 1/4" before the movement of the pedal engages the the push rod? I might have that already.

 

[260Alpine]

Mike, Yeah, You want a little freeplay so the master cylinder is disengaged when the pedal is up.

 

[Mike Armstrong]

Mike, Yeah, You want a little freeplay so the master cylinder is disengaged when the pedal is up.

Copy that, I'll get back at tomorrow.

 

[hartmandm]

A picture showing the clutch and brake pedal springs. There is a cup that retains the spring.

Mike

 

[Mike Armstrong]

A picture showing the clutch and brake pedal springs. There is a cup that retains the spring.

Mike

Nice, thanks man.

I have the springs and cups in place. On the right ide of your picture, that large spring next to the pedal arm, that's what I don't have.

 

[hartmandm]

The vertical spring to the right of the brake arm is on the accelerator pedal. A picture from a different angle is attached.

Mike

 

[260Alpine]

Mike, The cups and springs are the return springs on the Alpine. Those are the master cylinder to pedal springs I was thinking of.

 

[Mike Armstrong]

The vertical spring to the right of the brake arm is on the accelerator pedal. A picture from a different angle is attached.

Mike

Thanks for the clarification Mike.

 

[Mike Armstrong]

Mike, The cups and springs are the return springs on the Alpine. Those are the master cylinder to pedal springs I was thinking of.

Ahh, I see. So I do have those in place. I just wanted to make I wasn't missing return springs attached to the pedal arms, so I should be good.

 

[Mike Armstrong]

After a test drive the brakes are better. Still have to put my foot into it but they are more effective. That might only be do to tightening up the drum adjustment or perhaps doing a better bleed with the power bleeder. Perhaps with using this particular dual MC without a booster this is as good as I can expect. I'm used to my trucks effortless power brakes and the last vehicle I used to drive without power brakes was a 61 Chevy back in High School.

Today I'll pull the drivers side drum off and see if the 'grease' is back. If it is I suspect a leaking cylinder, even though I replaced the rubber seal on its piston. I can pull the piston and reseat the seal to see if that cures the problem, we'll see.

Another option, as Jim has pointed out, would be to go to the larger early series drum cylinders. How difficult is it to find a decent pair of those? Is anyone making a new replacement?

 

[mikephillips]

Not that simple, the entire assembly has to be swapped to use the early cylinders. The self adjusting changed just about everything and you'd need the manual adjust backing plates that everything mounts to, the emergency brake levers, shoes, springs and cylinders. The retaining pins and cylinder clips can be swapped, but that's about it. All can be found, but installing also means pulling the hubs as the backing plates won't fit over them. You'd have to decide if it's worth the effort, personally I'd say no.

 

[260Alpine]

Mike, It would be a job, but you would have better pedal feel and better braking in rear. Two other options are changing pedal ratio or adding a remote booster to front. On the remote booster you can get kits to rebuild a used one, but it is not always successful. The Midlands 5" used by street rods is supposedly pretty good. On MGB's the remote booster is used in conjunction with larger rear cylinders for balance.

 

[hartmandm]

If your wheel cylinder rebuild wasn't successful, you can purchase new rear wheel cylinders from Sunbeam Specialties and Classic Sunbeam.

Mike

 

[Mike Armstrong]

Thanks guys. As Mike pointed out, that's a pretty involved project just to get a bit more braking out of the rears. I'm not too lean on investing in a booster, yet.

Sort of hope to see that drivers side cylinder leaking just to have a reason for the weak braking.

 

[Mike Armstrong]

If your wheel cylinder rebuild wasn't successful, you can purchase new rear wheel cylinders from Sunbeam Specialties and Classic Sunbeam.

Mike

Good point. The cylinders must be original. I would imagine the bores and pistons are worn. I wonder how effective I can expect them to be even after replacing the seals.

 

[260Alpine]

Mike, Maybe if someone has both early and late they can measure the OD. They may be the same and you may be able to bore yours from 3/4" to 7/8" and use the early piston and kit.

 

[Mike Armstrong]

I've been buying parts from Sunbeam Specialties for awhile now, I might just call Rick, tell him what I'd like to do and have him measure them or just send me a set and I'll see if they fit.