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V6 Motor and Trans help

Discussion in 'Modified Alpine' started by srbaker, May 28, 2016.

  1. srbaker

    srbaker Donation Time

    T9 Bellhousing Dimension

    The bellhousing is roughly 7" in length and the shaft length is about 7 5/8" in length

    Also included a couple of pics of tranny and bell

    Thanks

    http://www.mustangiitech.com/index....wheel-comparison&catid=76:hardware&Itemid=141

    Site used as reference, looks like my bellhousing or pretty close (the fox body one)

     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Jun 10, 2016
  2. MikeH

    MikeH Diamond Level Sponsor

    But as the site says they are comparing V8 setups

    "These pictures compare the factory 83-93 V-8 fox body t-5 bellhousing/flywheel and 76-78 V-8 Mustang II bellhousing"
     
  3. srbaker

    srbaker Donation Time

    Using only a source of T5 measurements

    Ok so does someone have the V6 Bellhousing measurements or a link to same?
    Or I can just keep searching...
     
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2016
  4. DanR

    DanR Diamond Level Sponsor

    Steve, I'll provide the measurements to the Mutt II Bell Housing in a little bit, haven't had my coffee and Biscuit.

    The shifter on the tail shaft in the PIC looks to be too far to the rear for a good fit in an Alpine. Could be wrong, but what's the measurements? 22 " ?

    DanR
     
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2016
  5. todd reid

    todd reid Gold Level Sponsor

    Steve,
    I run a T9 in my alpine. It's a decent transmission, though not as robust as the T-5. I think you will find that the shift lever comes up 3-4 inches further back than the Alpine's does,.so you will need to do some surgery to either the car or the trans (or both). My trans has the shifter moved forward (3" IIRC). 5th gear (overdrive) is usually .825, which is quite different than the V-8 T-5, so you want to give some thought to your overall gearing, which would include tire diameter, rear end ratio, etc. Engine build (and resulting power band) and intended use of the car are other considerations.

    Best of luck!

    Todd Reid
     
  6. srbaker

    srbaker Donation Time

    Thanks for the info Todd

    Thanks for the response

    It is simply going to be a driver, cruiser as I have two other convertibles.

    How do you find 5th gear on the highway? Do you run the stock Alpine rear end? I will probably be going to 14" or 15" minilites

    Did you have to mod the tranny tunnel?

    My purchase was a complete drivetrain deal which is how I ended up with the T9 as it was already mated to the 2.8L and I have a '79 Mustang rearend I won't be using.

    I have been researching ways to re-locate the shifter and suspect I will just fabricate some extenders. The shifter on this T9 already has an extender welded on to it to move it forward a little over 2" when it was put in the Mustang so it may work anyway as is.

    Now that I have acquired almost everything I need I am just waiting for my new garage to be built before getting my hands dirty.



     
  7. RootesRacer

    RootesRacer Donation Time

    Not to be too nitpicky here but its a type 9 (or type n actually), not a T9.
    A T9 is a late 40s 4 speed made by warner (before it was borg warner).

    You may appreciate this some day if you ever go to buy parts for it.
     
  8. DanR

    DanR Diamond Level Sponsor

    Steve, A bit late in getting back to you....

    I had my Biscuit and coffee so I can report the bell housing for the Mustang II manual measures seven and three eights inches (7 3/8").

    DanR
     
  9. todd reid

    todd reid Gold Level Sponsor

    V6 Motor and Trans help

    Steve,
    I run 15" wheels, 195/60 tires, and a 3.22 rear. 3000 rpm in 5th gear is approx. 70 mph. 3500 rpm is approx. 85 mph, which the car will do all day.
    I am running a stock '74 2800, 2 bbl carb with the pollution crap removed, and home made exhaust manifolds that undoubtedly do not flow as well as headers. I find the most usable part of the power band is 2500-4000 rpm, although the engine can rev higher. I have undoubtedly traded some acceleration for long-legged cruising ability, but it suits my needs, and I can pull away from a stock Alpine in just about any situation.

    Perhaps the best plan of attack is to put your engine and trans into your Alpine using the stock rear, and see how you like it? I am sure the car will be drivable. You can always change/adjust the rear end at a later date. Ford used a 3.22 rear in the European Capri, and 3.55 in the Mustang II (a heavier car) in conjunction with non-od 4 speed transmissions, which gives you an idea of what they thought was optimum.

    Just my 2 cents - good luck with whatever path you choose!

    TR
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2016
  10. srbaker

    srbaker Donation Time

    Curious why GM 2.8L V6 not used

    As I research and source out parts for my car I keep seeing links to other British swaps using the GM 60 degree V6. I am curious as to why that is not the preferable swap as there seems to be quite a few around as well as the availability of performance parts. I have also seen references to the S10 T5 in various readings. I am sure there must be something that makes the Ford motor preferable over the GM.

    I understand you can swap just about anything into anything if you have the skill and the money.

    It just seems the Ford motor and parts are harder to find and more expensive especially the performance end of things.

    Just curious

    *The '79 Mustang 2.8L I purchased seems to be in great shape as I delve further into the motor*
     
  11. DanR

    DanR Diamond Level Sponsor

    Steve, Probably it has most to do with the steering.

    The MuttII oil pan and pickup tube is also in the way of the cross member. That is why you need the '83-85 2.8 v6 Ranger/Bronco II pan.

    The Siamese exhaust ports fit the bill for the 2.8 V6 and the near impossible mate to the steering of the Alpine.

    DanR

    P.S. There is a site: "www.burtonpower.com/" that has some great stuff for the 2.8 V6
     
  12. DanR

    DanR Diamond Level Sponsor

    Steve, There are several guys on the Forum with gm stuff.... Barry Knight and James (our Sect).
     
  13. V6 JOSE

    V6 JOSE Donation Time

    Hi Steve,

    I can´t remember the guys´name, but he is a member of this forum. He has done the GM V6 swap, but said that if he were to do it again, he´d use the Ford 2.8 V6 instead, because it is a ton easier to swap. He had to change the steering system to a rack and pinion system in order to make it fit. If I were to go to all that trouble, I would swap in a Ford small block, because you´ll need to do as much work as if you did the GM V6.


     
  14. shapeshaver

    shapeshaver Donation Time

    Seriously? Is this diatribe still going on here? Completely not true! I have done a GM V6 swap with the ford T5 in my 62. It's a beautiful swap that looks like it was meant to be in there!
    http://www.lx9alpine.com/lx9-v6.html

    The engine is an LX9 3.5 liter that in stock form produces 200HP and 220 ft lbs of torque, before headers and any other modifications. The 3100, 3400, and 3500 engines were placed in many makes and models of GM cars and can be found for next to nothing. There is a healthy aftermarket for high performance parts and a large community of support.
    http://www.britishcarconversions.com/
    https://wot-tech.com/3500-lx9-2004-2006.html#4

    It allows for the stock Alpine steering (with the same steering center link modification the Ford V6 swaps require) and has no interference from the engine or headers allowing full range steering lock to lock. http://www.lx9alpine.com/transmission.html

    It requires custom headers like other swaps. http://www.lx9alpine.com/headers.html

    The Ford Cologne V6 is a heavy, inconvenient, inefficient, under-performing dinosaur. The only reason people use it is because a kit is sporadically available and it has been highly publicized as the only alternative. For a long time it was, and it could be a wonderful improvement over stock. But that was the distant past and this misinformation is consistently being presented as fact from the producer of that kit. (With the obvious motivations that he stands to loose out on your money, some false self esteem, and his social status as the unofficial leader of the "dark side". It's time for the modified Alpine community to become "Enlightened"!).

    The MG community has fully embraced this engine for swaps and has already worked out all the parts and pieces to swap the LX9 3500 in and get it running. The parts of the swap that are unique to our Alpines are custom motor mounts, (which work with an unmodified cross-member, using the original motor mount holes), custom headers, and the previously mentioned steering center link modification.

    If all you want is more power or more reliable power, all the numbers point to a modern aluminum block four cylinder swap. Much easier and straight forward than other alternatives.

    If you want a beautiful, high performance drive train setup with the reliability and efficiency of a modern engine in stock form, or a lighter, quicker car that will outrun and out corner many Tigers, the GM 3500 is a great place to start looking.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GM_High_Value_engine#LX9
     
  15. DanR

    DanR Diamond Level Sponsor

    Very Nice!!

    Sharpe, As the name implies "Sharpe looking conversion" too!

    Very well documented links from what I have read. The headers you have are very similar to the ones I designed for my 2.8 V6 Mustang II/Bronco II implant in the Alpine, very neat and smooth in design running straight back.

    How did you route the exhaust from your collector? Through the frame similar to the Tiger?

    Thanks for posting your "Project" it sure looks nice. Bill Blue a long time member here will be Happy to see it too.

    DanR
     

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