Series I race car for sale

[Alpineracer8]

There's a really nice black Series I currently on Ebay that has been converted over to vintage racing specs. The guy wants an absolute mint for it, and if this is the car I think it is, he's probably just trying to get his money back. I'll bet everyone a dollar to a doughnut that this is the "all original" black Series I that came up on Ebay probably somewhere around two years ago. The car was from Virginia and it had a vintage VA plate on it. It was a real nice-looking all original time-capsule Series I and I think the guy had a "buy-it-now" price of somewhere around $17K on it. I saved pics of the car on my hard drive and today, when I saw the race car come on Ebay, I referred back to my saved pics of the time-capsule Series I. The owner did not restore the dash facia and it still has the exact same marks on it that the time-capsule SI had. It's got to be the same car. I've attached the pics of it that I saved so you could all see for yourselves.

Personally, I think it's a shame that the car got the "race car treatment." That means there's just one less unmolested Alpine in the world. However, for selfish reasons, I'd love to see him get his price since my Series I race car is also for sale for 1/3 the cost of his and is prepped every bit as properly. Anyway, check it out on Ebay...it's a gorgeous car.

Take care,

 

[Alpineracer8]

Here's some of the Ebay pics of the way the car looks now...do you all think it's the same car? Look closely at the dash in the interior pics.

 

[RootesRacer]

Doesnt look too "race" molested other than the black paint on the wire wheels and missing bumpers.

 

[Alpine 1789]

Best of all, the engine "was prepared by Jim Ellis noted Sunbeam engine builder." Way to go Jim. You are now famous.

 

[jumpinjan]

Well, what an heck of a nice guy! $30,000 of hotrod junk! Well, I'm glad Jim Ellis & David George made some money from this moron.

 

[sunbeam74]

Jan,

Is his asking price too much - no. This months Vintage Race Car Journal has a pricing guide on the "Under 2 Liters" category.
Trust me he has far more in it. Andy or any of the vintage race car guy can relate. Nice car... well prepared.

Can he get his price? I hope so.

Steve

 

[puff4]

Nice car. But... "Jaguire"?? Ouch.

He should take off those hooded headlight covers and gain an extra 5 mph!

 

[alpine_64]

The car was in a TEAE news letter last year competing in a hill climb, i thought it looked quite good.

Jan.. whats with all the anger.. and why would you assume Jim and David "amde some money" from this guy? .. not sure if its just the way it reads because of your first comment.. but sounds like you are implying they charged him a lot.. from what i know.. and others on the board.. Jim would have charged a fair rate regardless of who was asking to have work done, one of the most honest guys on the board.

 

[sunbeam74]

He had it at Pittsburgh's Vintage GP last year, too.
It had a lot of interest and comments. I really hope he does well on the bidding.

I know what it takes to put a race car together and it isn't cheap:

ATL cells are many hundreds (700-800 for a stock size)
Dunlops R5's 1000-1200.00 for a set of 4
Dayton Competition wheels 1200.00 for a set of 4
Roll bar setup $?
Koni's (though he has the levers in the rear) a full set for a later car is over 800.00
Fire suppression with plumbing
etc....

That's without the price of the car/body+paintwork, interior, engine, transmission, rear end rebuilds. As well as other modifications. It gets expensive.

Steve

 

[chrisheadrick]

Tragedy, if true

I mean, kudos to the race fans out there, but if it is said car, the original black/red/whitewall combination was gorgeous. I mean, that was one classy Alpine. I would have definitely had interest in buying that car. Certainly not a $17K interest in today's market, but I would have had interest...

Would have wished that he'd made a racer out of a car in less lovely condition/setup, but hey--there are race fans out there too, I understand, who will see what was done as an improvement.

Sigh.

 

[alpine_64]

If it is the same car, and from the description in the ebay ad, it seems to be, the owner has kept the original seats, bumpers, wheels+ tyres and also the engine.

It would be easy to bring it back to stock, and you can remove the fuel cell.. so its not like it has been irreversibly changed.

I do take the point that in some ways its a shame to do it to such a well preserved car, but its not like they have gone through and changed it that much that its hard to convert it back.

 

[sunbeam74]

The real tragedy is most of the significant historic racing Alpines have been cutup and scrapped... and in many instances people knew what they had. Adding insult to injury many of the ones I have tracked made it into the 90's before meeting their end.

Those aren't coming back but as replicas.

It is a nice car but from the photos of the car in 2007 it looks like it has already been repainted and the most of the interior redone. It still is a very nice car and the only exterior change is the wheels. Basically this is how you'd race prep an Alpine in the early to mid-60's.... very simple.

Steve

 

[Jim E]

Was a fun motor build and should be one heck of a nice mover, this is the slightly destroked version of a chevy rod motor. I was thinking this car got set up with dual side draft 40s but has the down draft weber on it, thinking dual 40s would make a diff in how it goes. The shop that was assembling the car if I recall correct is a pretty high zoot outfit. Think they have a website... I am certain the build cost of this car is multiples of the asking price.

 

[fireboltgirl]

It is the same car!

Andy is correct, it's the same car. I saw it in Hemmings 2 years ago and called because it was 15 miles from my house in MD. At the time, I was completely unfamiliar with Sunbeams and searching for a British car to use as a daily driver in nice weather. After some research, I decided the car was too original to be used on a daily basis and deserved an easier life. The price of $17K also seemed high for an Alpine. Now, in the midst of restoring a Series 3 that I stumbled on, the $17K seems like a bargain. I still have the original seller's contact info, so I sent him the current eBay listing. He's a Packard guy and a nut for originality. He was mortified that the car had been altered and told me the buyer told him he was the president of a local Sunbeam club and would be keeping the car in it's original state. He also said the mileage was 26,000 and documented as original with registration receipts. I've attached a few pics he sent me in 2008. The MD tag dates back 25 years and in MD tags do not travel with the car, so the original seller must have had the car since the early 1980's. He said the car had no paint work. Looking at the 2008 photos I attached, does the cowl appear to have been painted? The upholstery was said to be original and I read an posting here to the contrary. Can someone explain how they could tell the difference? Since the car was presented to me as 100% original, I would be interested in comments about this topic from readers more knowledgeable than myself.

Kim
Series 3
Tiger II

 

[Limey]

I'm with Joda I mean Jan,

Want a racer? Go find a high miler and make it live again as a racer. What kind of Fraggle Rock muppet with too much money and not enough brains takes a lovely low miler and F's with it? That's a pimp job not a racer. Deescraceful. We're bustin our balls here trying to save the remains of the 'marque' and this tit with a wallet takes a high arc piss over a bit of history and asks top dollar for his efforts. Damn his prostate. May he get no joy out of it.

Oliver

 

[65beam]

series 1 racer

just another guy that isn't worried about everything being original and since it's his money and his car he did what he wanted. my red harrington has 24000 original miles on it. did you ever take a close look at it to see what was left off of it? it no longer looks like a frog squatting.

 

[old grumpy]

Do you refer to this black car as "molested"?
Why not "improved" or "renewed" or even "developed"

Interesting things that would have been done by the factory technical dept. but was stopped by some office gray suit no-car-interested person.

No decent person could have approved the non-working Solex twin-choke carb. but still it came with some Alpines. Replace it with a similar-looking Weber DCD and the car is certainly "improved"

 

[Alpineracer8]

Do you refer to this black car as "molested"?
Why not "improved" or "renewed" or even "developed"

Interesting things that would have been done by the factory technical dept. but was stopped by some office gray suit no-car-interested person.

No decent person could have approved the non-working Solex twin-choke carb. but still it came with some Alpines. Replace it with a similar-looking Weber DCD and the car is certainly "improved"

You've missed the point here. Of course there are improvements that could have been made to the cars, and people are continuing to re-engineer the cars to be more reliable and fun to drive. However, dead-stock original cars are extremely hard to come up with, so why in hell did this guy take one of those "time capsules" and essentially destroy it's originality? I agree; it's his money and he can do what he wants. But, I submit that he really doesn't give a damn about the marque as much as he just wanted a "race car." Why not preserve the time capsules as they are which, in the long run, helps the hobby of restoring these cars?

I've been down the road of building a competition Alpine and I can see how one could have that much in a car, especially if he paid someone to do all of his work. IMHO, he should have just bought another competition car to begin with and saved this car; it looked to be well worth saving.

 

[old grumpy]

Honestly, the Alpine S1 is not a particularly unusual car. I would call my Ginetta G21 unusual because it's one of about 45 built.

Can a car have renovation that makes it in better condition then when it left the factory. Is it destroyed or is it OK?

What is dead-stock? How far can we go? A dead-stock original car must be one that after it left the factory is untouched, unused, original tires and not even oil change?

There must be compromises......

 

[John W]

heck of a nice guy doesn't quite fit. This isn't a compromise, it's a dumbass idea that got carried out. I hope everyone that worked on this one made a bundle. I should add that's his car and my opinion, which should be obvious.