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series 3 Trans Ratio
- Thread starter mototron
- Start date
DanR
Diamond Level Sponsor
Ratios according to....
On page 133 of the Sunbeam Rapier, Alpine 1955-65 Autobook by Kenneth Ball reads as follows:
Rapier I & II Top 1.00:1
Third 1.49:1
Second 2.47:1
First 3.19:1
Reverse 4.04:1
Alpine III; Top 1.00:1
Third 1.39:1
Second 2.14:1
First 3.35:1
Reverse 4.24:1
All other models: Top 1.00:1
Third 1.23:1
Second 1.89:1
First 2.96:1
Reverse 3.75:1
Would it be safe to assume that beings there were no specific listings for the Alpine I or II that "All other models" would include them?
DanR
On page 133 of the Sunbeam Rapier, Alpine 1955-65 Autobook by Kenneth Ball reads as follows:
Rapier I & II Top 1.00:1
Third 1.49:1
Second 2.47:1
First 3.19:1
Reverse 4.04:1
Alpine III; Top 1.00:1
Third 1.39:1
Second 2.14:1
First 3.35:1
Reverse 4.24:1
All other models: Top 1.00:1
Third 1.23:1
Second 1.89:1
First 2.96:1
Reverse 3.75:1
Would it be safe to assume that beings there were no specific listings for the Alpine I or II that "All other models" would include them?
DanR
RootesRacer
Donation Time
I think this info is in error.
Only the SIII (not all other models) got the close ratio trans.
Only the SIII (not all other models) got the close ratio trans.
DanR
Diamond Level Sponsor
Just Quoting the Book....
Just quoting the Book in reference that has sold thousands of copies.
Maybe a research of the PARTS MANUAL could BE OF some HELP?
Some other data can be obtained from the publication SAOC - The Alpine Guide, published by The Sunbeam Owners Club of the UK issue 2 page 12 where is does say the S III gearboxes were very close ratio, SV are moderately close and all others are wider ratio in common with many other Rootes cars.
DanR
Just quoting the Book in reference that has sold thousands of copies.
Maybe a research of the PARTS MANUAL could BE OF some HELP?
Some other data can be obtained from the publication SAOC - The Alpine Guide, published by The Sunbeam Owners Club of the UK issue 2 page 12 where is does say the S III gearboxes were very close ratio, SV are moderately close and all others are wider ratio in common with many other Rootes cars.
DanR
Last edited:
RootesRacer
Donation Time
Workshop manual says otherwise.
Only the SIII had what is called the close ratio transmission, yes the latest (SV) allsynch trans had a relatively close ratio trans, but not as close or as coveted as the SIII.
DanR
Diamond Level Sponsor
Bob, it's the number of of teeth on a gear and mated to another that make a ratio.... I think that is what my Dad told me!
If a tranny is 40 years old or older does it lose teeth yet still functional?
Just the ratio is no longer what it was new?
Am I reading your reply correctly? Or am I missing something?
Probably me, I'm 75 and going on the next "Big Number" soon.
DanR
If a tranny is 40 years old or older does it lose teeth yet still functional?
Just the ratio is no longer what it was new?
Am I reading your reply correctly? Or am I missing something?
Probably me, I'm 75 and going on the next "Big Number" soon.
DanR
Dan the Man
I was driving an Slll the other day and will say that it seems to wind out better in third gear better than all the other series.I had a GT for sale but could not part with it after flogging for a fews days with no buyers anywho
I say Sllls are the most fun to abuse...The ratios are also in the ClassicSunbeam by Chris McGovern
Agm
I was driving an Slll the other day and will say that it seems to wind out better in third gear better than all the other series.I had a GT for sale but could not part with it after flogging for a fews days with no buyers anywho
I say Sllls are the most fun to abuse...The ratios are also in the ClassicSunbeam by Chris McGovern
Agm
mototron
Donation Time
Yes I am looking to get a tighter ratio between 3rd and 4th
than my series 5 trans
Just put a set of 4:55 rear gears in the race car
to see if that helps get better pull in 3rd coming out of the corners
I do not know what the 4:55 Ham came out of
Bigger diameter gear but with 6 bolts holding on the ring instead of 8
Hope it hold up for the weekend
Rocco
than my series 5 trans
Just put a set of 4:55 rear gears in the race car
to see if that helps get better pull in 3rd coming out of the corners
I do not know what the 4:55 Ham came out of
Bigger diameter gear but with 6 bolts holding on the ring instead of 8
Hope it hold up for the weekend
Rocco
RootesRacer
Donation Time
The SV trans is almost as good as the SIII if you think it will count, drop one of those in there before embarking on a search for a SIII close ratio, they really are rather rare these days.
If you have an allsynch, it may not be the later SV with the closer ratios as SIV had wider ratios like the earlier transmissions but with synchros on all 4 fwd gears.
The 4.55 came from a Hillman Minx (or equiv.) that had 15 inch wheels.
Along when the Alpine came out, the Minx and its derivatives went to 13 inch wheels and the ratios dropped to 4.22 and 3.89.
The 4.55 gearset is not as strong as the later, mostly becuase its a bevel gear type R&P as compared to the hypoid. Its still plenty strong for such a light car.
If you could fine a 4.44 that would be ideal, hypoid and a decent racing ratio.
DanR
Diamond Level Sponsor
Based on what rear end you are planning, What RootesRacer says sounds like it will be great for your situation (4.44)
I agree with him about the SV "almost as good" too!
I agree with him about the SV "almost as good" too!
RootesRacer
Donation Time
Depends on the year/range.
65beam
Donation Time
ratio
dan,
the series 3 had non syncro trans in them. when we were rebuilding the trans for the lemans I was made aware that there were three different first gears for the non syncro. which one fits? we also found some weird things in the full syncro trans we were going to use in the series 4. it was in a car for years but when we put it in the series 4 it took little doug one shift at higher rpm's to find it had faults. a lot of the parts are still at the shop. I think you misunderstood that just because it should have had a specific part doesn't mean it has that part now. over the last 50 years a lot of things may have been changed that create problems now.
dan,
the series 3 had non syncro trans in them. when we were rebuilding the trans for the lemans I was made aware that there were three different first gears for the non syncro. which one fits? we also found some weird things in the full syncro trans we were going to use in the series 4. it was in a car for years but when we put it in the series 4 it took little doug one shift at higher rpm's to find it had faults. a lot of the parts are still at the shop. I think you misunderstood that just because it should have had a specific part doesn't mean it has that part now. over the last 50 years a lot of things may have been changed that create problems now.
jdoclogan
Platinum Level Sponsor
Did my first autocross at SUNI IV with my original Series III (I'm the second owner). Thought I was an amazing driver when I took first by 3 seconds faster than second place. Then I later read about the Series III close ratio transmission. Clearly the 50 year old transmission provided a huge advantage for a rookie on that particular course. My second autocross was at our Northwest gathering of Sunbeam/Rootes marques, put on by the Pacific Tiger Club, with my Harrington Le Mans sporting a factory (original owner said he ordered it from the factory) limited slip rear end and an updated all synchro transmission/OD. Took second to an awesome driver, Dick Sanders. As Snoopy would say to the Red Baron, "Someday Red Baron (Dick Sanders) someday."
Mototron, I understand your difficulties of trying to remove the hub from your Sunbeam axle. I am having the same difficulty on my limited slip axle. Anyone out there with a suggestion please share. By the way the limited slip axle has 9 large splines as oppose to the early Series Alpine 17 splines or later Series Alpine 25 splines.
Mototron, I understand your difficulties of trying to remove the hub from your Sunbeam axle. I am having the same difficulty on my limited slip axle. Anyone out there with a suggestion please share. By the way the limited slip axle has 9 large splines as oppose to the early Series Alpine 17 splines or later Series Alpine 25 splines.