Lucas Ignition Switches (Better Options?)

[loose_electron]

Hey All!

So last night I come back to my SB sitting in the parking lot. It's well past sundown and there's condensation all over the car.

Key in the ignition, try to start and nothing.
Three tries later and it fires right up.

Now considering I'm an electrical engineer and I rewired the car myself, I know that this is due to the ignition switch contacts not functioning properly. Dirty contacts, or (probably) condensation inside the ignition switch.

That said, it's a Lucas ignition switch, bought new from Sunbeam Specialties about 3 years ago.

Anybody had a similar problem, or can suggest a better quality ignition switch substitution?

Thanks,
Jerry

 

[Tom H]

Never had a bad contact in the ignition switch in 50 yrs of beaming. But I have had an intermittent solenoid. The spade lug where the wire from the ignition switch connects to the solenoid had a bad solder joint. Solenoid would not engage. But the least shift or shake would make it work.

An earlier time the solenoid ground was poor so solenoid was intermittent.

Tom

 

[DanR]

Jerry, That is a new one to me. I have never had an ignition switch problem. Fingers crossed

Recognizing your background in Electric stuff makes me feel really, really good too

 

[loose_electron]

Dan and Tom -

Yeah I had a bad solenoid early in the build of this, I used a Ford solenoid and found out it was actually a Chinese knock-off that was not well done. Replaced that with an original Ford OEM solenoid and all was good.

The original ignition switch was old and tired when I did the re-wire so it got replaced by a Lucas one, new, from SS.

When I rewired the car, I put LED idiot lights on both the "Accessory" and the "run" power feeds that come straight off the 4 position ignition switch. Both should be bright green when the car is in run or start/crank position. Neither of them were. After a few on-off with the switch all was good and everything ran fine. That says ignition switch or connections to the ignition switch.

I'm trying to get some more data on a "marine grade" 4 position ignition switch I am thinking of using. There's lots of generic ignition switches out there but a lot of them look like Chinese junk.

 

[DanR]

Seems as if an old 1964 chevy pickup truck had a good one that might do.

 

[Gordon Holsinger]

Hey All!

So last night I come back to my SB sitting in the parking lot. It's well past sundown and there's condensation all over the car.

Key in the ignition, try to start and nothing.
Three tries later and it fires right up.

Now considering I'm an electrical engineer and I rewired the car myself, I know that this is due to the ignition switch contacts not functioning properly. Dirty contacts, or (probably) condensation inside the ignition switch.

That said, it's a Lucas ignition switch, bought new from Sunbeam Specialties about 3 years ago.

Anybody had a similar problem, or can suggest a better quality ignition switch substitution?

Thanks,
Jerry

The newer ignition switches are not as well made as ones from the early 70’s I bought one a few years ago that failed in six months! Switch contact not properly made. My car has one from 1967 that works just fine!

 

[alpine_64]

There are 2 Lucas repro brands... The majority of them in the green boxes iirc were made in india and known to be built to a lower standard as they wete expected to go into hobby cars with less millage ( same goes for many rubber, chrome and other parts in the repro world)

I had a couple of the "new" lucas swicthes fail in late 90s early 00's and replaced with a decent original one from a hillman minx and never looked back

So find a good original or NOS one if you can

 

[loose_electron]

Sierra makes stuff for the boating industry.
It cost more ($45) but I think the price will yield better quality.
Having an unreliable ignition switch is a non-starter for me!

Sierra MP39070 Conventional Accessory-Off-Run-Start Ignition Switch

• 4 Position Conventional Accessory-Off-Run-Start Ignition Switch
• Brass construction and backing nut
• Corrosion resistant
• 1 in. maximum panel thickness
• 4 screw tab terminal connections
• Knurled black chrome face nut with rubber cap
• 7/8 in. hole size
• Ignition rated 15 amps @12 volt DC
• Solenoid rated 30 amps @12 volt DC
• Accessory rated 15 amps @12 volt DC

Got one ordered from an EBay boating vendor.

Info here: https://inetmarine.com/SierraMP39070ConventionalAccessory-Off-Run-StartIgnitionSwitch.aspx

 

[loose_electron]

Seems as if an old 1964 chevy pickup truck had a good one that might do.

That would be an excellent option if I could find a NOS one.
(I did some looking without results)

The things sold now to plug into that spot all seem to be the cheap chinese/elsewhere knockoffs as well.

 

[Tom H]

I put LED idiot lights on both the "Accessory" and the "run" power feeds

Great idea. I thought of doing similar, except I thought I would wire them to the end points of a couple circuits. like solenoid actuation line , solenoid starter output, coil power, OD solenoid feed. etc. I do have an LED on the OD solenoid feed, so I can see that the OD relay is actually doing its job. That LED became redundant once I put both contacts of the OD relay in parallel, using a diode in the path from Contact to coil). The common OD warning lamp provides the same info when wired as as above. I think your idea to wire the LEDs right near the Ign Switch makes a lot of sense, except maybe the starter feed

Tom

 

[DanR]

The things sold now to plug into that spot all seem to be the cheap chinese/elsewhere knockoffs as well.

I found some "STANDARD" switches for the '64 Chevy on Ebay that look like the old ones as I recall. Are they the cheap one also ? STANDARD was always top of the line imo

 

[loose_electron]

I found some "STANDARD" switches for the '64 Chevy on Ebay that look like the old ones as I recall. Are they the cheap one also ? STANDARD was always top of the line imo

It's tough to say. The reason I bought the Lucas labelled one from SS was I expected to get an OEM Lucas switch. As others stated above, Lucas boxed devices are cheap reproductions of the original device. If I could have found a NOS 4 position ignition switch from the classic "big 3" of American cars (GM, Ford Chrysler) I would have jumped on it. I suspect the new replacement switches for cars prior to locking steering columns are mostly knockoffs.

Added Knowledge: https://www.standardbrand.com/en/ecatalog?partdetail=US-14

That one looks pretty promising. As Dan mentioned the "Standard Motor Products" has been around for a long time and seems to produce good products. If the one I ordered does not work out, I will give that one a try.

 

[loose_electron]

Just an update to this discussion.

I replaced the Lucas switch with the Sierra Marine switch described above. All works well.

Then, I took the Lucas ignition switch apart to see what was inside.

Contacts inside the switch are bare copper, no zinc, no nickel plating, and a flimsy spring used to push the contacts together to maintain pressure.

Good quality switches used plated contacts - This thing was done on the cheap. -

Consequently, I suggest going to either the Sierra Marine or Standard Motor Products switches discussed earlier.

 

[DanR]

Jerry, In some of the switches that appear to be like the originals that have failed on me, they are really cheap design and poor quality. I purchased a couple from Victoria British years ago that did not perform well.

The switch lever broke and actually fell apart. The insides looked like what you described.

I make an attempt to purchase "originals" when I find them for sale at the British Car Events.

 

[loose_electron]

Jerry, In some of the switches that appear to be like the originals that have failed on me, they are really cheap design and poor quality. I purchased a couple from Victoria British years ago that did not perform well.

The switch lever broke and actually fell apart. The insides looked like what you described.

I make an attempt to purchase "originals" when I find them for sale at the British Car Events.

Yeah, I fully agree. As an EE, I deal with high reliability issues for many products. A high quality switch contact uses plated contacts (most often nickel) and has a strong pressure method pushing the contacts together. This thing had neither.