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Harrington Design Proportions

Depends if you are doing the A LM or the C / D ... To me only the fastback on the A had good proportions, the others they increased the rooflinr to a longer arc and gave more headroom over the parcel shelf making the rear look a bit tall and ungainly
 
Oops Michael, you start to enter into loose grounds here. Beware of the many HLM owners on this forum ;)HLM design is a matter of taste certainly, but with a proper set of wheels and suspension adjustment towards lower in the front & higher in the rear the looks will definitely improve a lot from the appearant "rear heaviness". Harrington's intention to maximize the interior space as much as possible is quite undebateable though...
 
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MGBGT - No soft top, hardtop only, no convertible.

Alpine GT - No soft top, hardtop PLUS convertible.

The Alpine ST and GT are otherwise the same car, I think.

Never considered whether the B and BGT are the same.

British design was the apex of car design "back in the day." So were the mechanics, as far as enjoyment (IMO).
 
bernd_st said:
Oops Michael, you start to enter into loose grounds here. Beware of the many HLM owners on this forum ;)HLM design is a matter of taste certainly, but with a proper set of of wheels and suspension adjustment towards lower in the front & higher in the rear the looks will definitely improve a lot from the appearant "rear heaviness". Harrington's intend to maximize the interior space as much as possible is quite undebateable though...
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I know we have passionate HLM owners here, and certain colours on them can hide some of the issues, as can raising the rear ride height so the wheels dont look buried in a sea of bodywork.. you can photograph an HLM from certain angles to eliminate the issue.. but there are many views where the mass over the rear wheel and the accelerated radius as it gets to the back to merge into the rear valance exaggerated the issue.

It actually often reminds me of the Chrysler crossfire coupe and the first of the Bentley Continental coupes in the early 00s ... Kind of like a dog taking squat look ....

Just my .02 ... The HLM can look great from some angles...but the roof was just too high and the back.. and while the fins on the C/D helpeed balance the roof the increased arc still means a lot of body over the rear wheels and worse.. on the C/D they added the massive reverse LAT scoop at the back....making it even taller.

The A was the best proportioned in my eye.. had they added a hatch to it... And made a e type style luggage deck... Would be stylish and practical
 
Well, isn't that the question? Is there design validity to the MG drawing above? And if there is, what would the lines on an Alpine with round or square hard top, or a Harrington look like?

I thought it was somewhat amazing that the lines of the windshield all meet at a point and the lines of the rear all meet at a point, and those two points are on the same plane. I suspect the Alpine lines do not similarly match.

So is that a bad or questionable design on the Sunbeam's part, or is this drawing just a bunch of silliness?
 
To really do it right, you'd have to re-engineer the body/coachwork on the entire car from go. The Harrington's are cool in their own way but it's a huge, nearly impossible ask for the designers to create anything out of a stock Alpine body that doesn't look like it did. Not knocking anything and I'd rather they exist than not.
 
alpine_64 said:
The A was the best proportioned in my eye.. had they added a hatch to it... And made a e type style luggage deck... Would be stylish and practical
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Indeed the A looks great too, but from interior space point of view it doesn't add much to the original early series with a hardtop on. Would rather say the short hatch is a joke and leaves only space for a small sports bag if any. So overall useability with the big hatch & foldable rear seat is way better on a HLM.
Anyway, if there would be a properly priced A on the the market - they are way rarer - I 'ld feel still tempted. Just to somehow complete my collection - if it's ever gonna be completed ;)
 
bernd_st said:
Indeed the A looks great too, but from interior space point of view it doesn't add much to the original early series with a hardtop on. Would rather say the short hatch is a joke and leaves only space for a small sports bag if any. So overall useability with the big hatch & foldable rear seat is way better on a HLM.
Anyway, if there would be a properly priced A on the the market - they are way rarer - I 'ld feel still tempted. Just to somehow complete my collection - if it's ever gonna be completed ;)
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That's why the hatch would help.. but the main difference between the A and the later cars was the removal of the rear scuttle.. the C/D removed the scuttle and had the same areas as the HLM.. the change in the C/D design was extending the top down into the boot recess.. but that's also why their proportion isn't quite as nice as the A
 
Scotty said:
To really do it right, you'd have to re-engineer the body/coachwork on the entire car from go. The Harrington's are cool in their own way but it's a huge, nearly impossible ask for the designers to create anything out of a stock Alpine body that doesn't look like it did. Not knocking anything and I'd rather they exist than not.
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The Lyrad was created in 1967 by Darrel Townsend in Montreal Canada from a 1960 Series I Alpine. I acquired the Lyrad in 2011. With the assistance of Jim Simpson from Simpson Design (https://www.simpsondesign.net/) I began transforming the Lyrad to its current state. It now sports a Miata suspension and Torsen rear end. The engine and transmission from Townsend's build is a MKII Jaguar 3.4/Jaguar 4 speed with Overdrive. I modified a Jaguar XKE hood to fit. It has a Lotus 19 front section (Townsend's original build). I fabricated the cam tail to emulate a 1963 Aston Martin DP215.

1734713084985.jpeg1734713846986.jpeg1734713455631.jpeg1734713716765.jpeg
 
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Well, I threw some lines on an early Alpine. I don't see much similar specific intersections of lines. But again, don't know if the MG one is real or a coincidence - or how much the lines were manipulated to get to intersections.

1734714343395.png
 
moved the line that went through the rear axle, to be parallel with the back of the hard top and 'kind of' the rear wheel well, and maybe it intersects the windshield convergence. Maybe.

1734715198700.png
 
There is a Harrington looking car that was in the Alpine Horn years ago, and I pointed out here on a post somewhere. It was light green. If I recall, the guy used a Datsun/Nissan top of some sort, and changed the windshield too, and it worked very well.
 
FWIW, on that Harrington, I note the top line of the rear fender and door appear horizontal. I think that is best for the look of the car. Here, I think it was accomplished with what appears to be a slightly lower rear, and definitely higher front - and I hate when there is a huge gap ontop of the front tire.

This is another point I've raised elsewhere about how cool the early race cars from Ken Miles, etc., were horizontal, and my posts about some cars having the rear fins pointing up too high.
 
jdoclogan said:
The Lyrad was created in 1967 by Darrel Townsend in Montreal Canada from a 1960 Series I Alpine. I acquired the Lyrad in 2011. With the assistance of Jim Simpson from Simpson Design (https://www.simpsondesign.net/) I began transforming the Lyrad to its current state. It now sports a Miata suspension and Torsen rear end. The engine and transmission from Townsend's build is a MKII Jaguar 3.4/Jaguar 4 speed with Overdrive. I modified a Jaguar XKE hood to fit. It has a Lotus 19 front section (Townsend's original build). I fabricated the cam tail to emulate a 1963 Aston Martin DP215.

View attachment 33828View attachment 33829
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Jerry, looks you have achieved some progress on the Lyrad project. Very good. Want to see it finished ...
 
B GT was esthetic genius back in the day.

Alpine "genius" was even more so.

From "back in the day" (personal) memory, as it is now, lines or no lines, snug as a bug in a rug with the Alpine hard top in snowy mountain winters, AND with the same mechanically "musical" Alpine, but unlike the B GT, the top went (and goes) back in the garage when the weather improved (improves).

The Harringtons (A, C, D, Lemans...all) are (arguably) some of the most beautiful cars from the greatest car designers that ever collaborated, and certainly the rarest, yet, maybe, an afterthought recognition of the success of their British counter parts who designed the B GT. Who knows.

Great observations here. And appreciated, for what it's worth.
 
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