• Welcome to the new SAOCA website. Already a member? Simply click Log In/Sign Up up and to the right and use your same username and password from the old site. If you've forgotten your password, please send an email to membership@sunbeamalpine.org for assistance.

    If you're new here, click Log In/Sign Up and enter your information. We'll approve your account as quickly as possible, typically in about 24 hours. If it takes longer, you were probably caught in our spam/scam filter.

    Enjoy.

Caster shim V pic?

Alpine66

Donation Time
Anyone have a pic of what these look like? Dimensions would be good too.

I may need a set..
Thanks
 

Tom H

Platinum Level Sponsor
According to the WSM, the Castor is fixed and not adjustable ( page F-8). There are shims to adjust the Camber- page f-6. I can measure my spare camber shims and post the info.

Tom
 

Bill Blue

Platinum Level Sponsor
On a lot of Alpines, the only practical way to adjust caster is to place shims between the crossmember and frame. This is not a factory sanctioned adjustment, so "proper" shims are not available. But it is the only way to get some cars to drive properly.

Bill
 

Chuck Ingram

Donation Time
Castor can be adjusted at the top A arm mounting points.
This is where the single shims wouldbe used.
I do my own alignment on both our Sunbeams.
I am not able to do the 4 wheel alignment as that does take the more equipment then I have

I would not try anything involving the crossmember to frame shims. They are as good as they are.
 

pruyter

Donation Time
If the rear axle is not located parallel with the front axle, how do you adjust this? What amount of deviation is acceptable, my Sunbeam has a deviation of 7,5 mm according the specialist who measured this.
Thanks for a reply in advance!
Regards,

Peter
 

Bill Blue

Platinum Level Sponsor
Castor can be adjusted at the top A arm mounting points.
This is where the single shims wouldbe used.
I do my own alignment on both our Sunbeams.
I am not able to do the 4 wheel alignment as that does take the more equipment then I have

I would not try anything involving the crossmember to frame shims. They are as good as they are.

With no camber shims, my car has about 1/2* camber on the right side, and a little over 1* on the left. It has 1 1/2* of caster on one side and a little over 2* on the other. Totally inadequate and it drives like a dog. Adjusting caster using your method results in negative camber, which I do not want. Shimming the crossmember to 3* solves the problem.

I know of two other cars with the camber issue, so we need to tell drivers they may have to ignore the book if they want a good driving car.

Oh yes, my stock crossmember shims are in excellent condition.

Bill
 

Tom H

Platinum Level Sponsor
Chuck, I assume you mean that you CAN adjust the Castor slightly by using the single (half shim)of the normal Camber shim. Makes sense. Note that the WSM instructions for Camber adjustment state "Any short adjustment shims must be left undisturbed", obviously that is because moving the short shims would change the castor.

66, I will edit this post in a few minutes to add description and dimensions.

Tom
For a picture of the shims select page F10 here:
http://www.rootes1725cc.info/wsm145/WSM_F/F.htm

Dimensions: 3.85" long, 0.812 high, slots are 0.5" diameter, slightly below centerline such that there is 0.25 in of material at the top, slots are located 2.86" apart. Hole in the middle is 0.275" dia, located below centerline, 0.3" from bottom edge. Some of my shims are straight across the top and some have the notched area on top. I have 2 thicknesses; 0.062" and 0.100". Not sure what thicknesses are available. I am 99% sure that these shims were provided by my local (old fashioned) alignment shop 10 years ago that did my alignment. I suspect they are still fairly common. Note the short (half shim), item D, that's the piece that will change camber and castor at the same time
 
Last edited:

Chuck Ingram

Donation Time
With no camber shims, my car has about 1/2* camber on the right side, and a little over 1* on the left. It has 1 1/2* of caster on one side and a little over 2* on the other. Totally inadequate and it drives like a dog. Adjusting caster using your method results in negative camber, which I do not want. Shimming the crossmember to 3* solves the problem.

I know of two other cars with the camber issue, so we need to tell drivers they may have to ignore the book if they want a good driving car.

Oh yes, my stock crossmember shims are in excellent condition.

Bill

Bill
What works for you is fine. How far can you drive in a straight line with no hands on the wheel? You do need a degree more positive on the left to accommodate the slope of the road
I know peopLe who,used an aluminum yardstick cut to,width re your method
 

Chuck Ingram

Donation Time
Chuck, I assume you mean that you CAN adjust the Castor slightly by using the single (half shim)of the normal Camber shim. Makes sense. Note that the WSM instructions for Camber adjustment state "Any short adjustment shims must be left undisturbed", obviously that is because moving the short shims would change the castor.

66, I will edit this post in a few minutes to add description and dimensions.

Tom

Hi Tom
You got it
 

Chuck Ingram

Donation Time
I've been doing my own alignments for about 15 years
As for the rear axle. Take an exact center point in front of the crucifix. Measure to same point on both sides from that point.
 

pruyter

Donation Time
Thanks Chuck, but how do you adust the rear axle when it is not parallel with the front axle and what kind of deviation is acceptable?
 
Last edited:

Chuck Ingram

Donation Time
Thanks Chuck, but how do you adust the rear axle when it is not parallel with the front axle and what kind of deviation is acceptable?

Is your axle out of being right. This would be a trial and try again. Probably would remove axle and measure to the pins.. Check the pin hole in the mounting plate to see any sloppiness. It takes so,little to,put the axle out of square.

First though I,would take it to,a good front end shop. Check out car shows and talk to,the hot rodders as for sure they will know a good shop.
 

Bill Blue

Platinum Level Sponsor
If the rear axle is not located parallel with the front axle, how do you adjust this? What amount of deviation is acceptable, my Sunbeam has a deviation of 7,5 mm according the specialist who measured this.
Thanks for a reply in advance!
Regards,

Peter

There really is no adjustment for this. I would check the rear axle assembly to make sure the rubber bushes and frame mounts are in good shape and everything is assembled correctly. The mounting hole in the front rubber bushes is located off center. It could be as simple as removing and rotating the bushes. You might loosen the crossmember bolts and try to rotate it, but I doubt it would do much good, especially in view of the amount of non-parallelism. Keep in mind that almost anything can be wrong with a 50 year old car.

It is my understanding the only downside to this condition is the rear wheels will not track the front wheels correctly, making the car appear to go down the road slightly sideways. So the acceptable deviation is whatever you will tolerate.

Bill
 
Last edited:

pruyter

Donation Time
Thank you both Chuck an Bill for this information! Now I have at least something to check....

Regards,

Peter
 

Alpine66

Donation Time
Thanks for all the contributions to the thread, lot of good info.

While open to all the ideas, I'm in the same boat as Bill with camber, don't have any adjustment left on it and am concerned if I do the A arm adjustment I'll be on the wrong side of it

So I'll try the cross member shimming and see what happens, can always take it out and try the a arm.
 

Chuck Ingram

Donation Time
Many times farther than I could before shimming the crossmember.

Bill

One of the reasons for not shimming the cross member

When shimming at the upper A arms. The shim in front will give a negative
The shim in the back will give a positive. You might need a few shims and possibly longer bolts.

We are not talking huge numbers for castor

This is my last post on this thread.
 

Chuck Ingram

Donation Time
Thanks for all the contributions to the thread, lot of good info.

While open to all the ideas, I'm in the same boat as Bill with camber, don't have any adjustment left on it and am concerned if I do the A arm adjustment I'll be on the wrong side of it

So I'll try the cross member shimming and see what happens, can always take it out and try the a arm.

Cross member shimming will not correct camber. It's done at the A arm.
 
Top