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2.8l Build Thread, may be different than what you're used to! But hopefully educational.

mummert

Silver Level Sponsor
I'm building a 2.8l V6 for my MGB GT. I know its not an Alpine but the engine gives us common ground. I've had and interest in these engines for 30 +years but never done anything with one.

Having been in the race engine, and manufacturing business for almost as long. The right opportunity came to me to pickup up a good core engine for very little money and thought I would go for it.

Years ago I had some information on these engines but it wasn't much. Figuring that so much time had gone by that there would be more parts available and information to go with it. Turns out the evolution of the engine has moved but a freckle in the decades since.

I'm not trying to build a race engine, I want what most people want, decent idle not stock but not too lopey, broad powerband. Something with good street manners but will pull to 6500rpm if I want to shoot up an on ramp. Pump gas weekend cruiser.

Correct if I'm wrong but it seems like making 200 streetable hp is tough. There is very little dyno information, some vague head mod insight but no real flow bench data that I can find.

I know that there is a book that was written some years ago, some people thinks its great and some think it isn't worth the time go figure.

Having built race engines competed in Engine Master Challenges (too bad the last one was in 2019) I figured we would strike out with kind of a clean sheet build and see if we can't come up with some decent results.

It shouldn't be tough to make 200-210 streetable hp, some analytical investigation and possibly a little bit different recipe may be required to make it happen.

The induction is always the first place you look to see if your goals are possible, the 2800 has some curve balls thrown in the intake tract that will need straightening out . We have spent a considerable amount of time flowing the heads and the intake manifold. You have probably seen modification to the stock manifold , here is a video where dig into the cylinder heads.
 
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The videos are about porting cast iron heads in general but my 2800 heads are the crash test dummies. The heads are finished as far as porting is concerned but I will do a follow up video on some of the last details.
 
The 2.5l HSC piston is very close after you offset grind the crank .070"

Custom pistons will probably be built. It will simplify everything in the end. The cost won't be all that different in the end . After looking at the engine there are too many things that have to happen to try and make stock type pistons work.

-Decking engine block in excess (the 2.8 has too much deck ht. to run well)
-Extra milling of cylinder heads ( the heads are thin in the deck area, dont cut more than minimum.)
-Machining of intake manifold ( Self inflicted wound from cutting block and head)
-The factory piston rings are way to thick for a small engine today
- .945 diameter wrist pin is excessive in size an weight for 35hp cyl
-Last but not least, cast replacement pistons aren't free
 
Sounds like a good plan. Have you seen Dan R's extra header bolt mod and are you doing the 4 cooling holes in the head using a Ranger gasket as template? Looking forward to the comparisons you plan.
 
Yeah I saw something about that extra bolt, I was actually going to remove a bolt an run 4 per side. With thick flanges I don't see the need for all the extra bolts.
I planned on cutting all that Farhfugnugen off and putting the thermostat at the top of the manifold like pretty much every other engine in the world. It is a problem for the MG frame, and very complicated at the same time.
A remote Meziere waterpump should help shorten the engine up
 
Yeah, 2.9 has a top thermostat. Be nice if the 2.8 had an aluminum front cover too. Maybe repeat your work with the 2.9 too?
 
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I'll make the top thermostat work on the 2.8. The swap into the car will get easier. No driver side frame chopping.

Truthfully thermostats are kinda redundant these days anyways. On my offroad car I run a 3/4 outlet restrictor and a thermostatic fan switch. Car runs rock solid 180* all day long with no thermostat at all.

If I built another small 60 degree I would use 3.0l. Not that I think its a better engine , just much longer production life, many more parts and configurations to play with.
 
Hello Mummert
The 2.8 in the Areostar had a top mount thermostat housing I welded a rad cap housing to the top to add antifreeze
Dan
 
Interesting, what do the timing cover and water pump look like. I'm geussing they dont use the lower thermostat?
 
I think the Aerostar kept the 2.8 a year or two longer than the Ranger. Maybe they converted to top thermostat before they went to the 2.9?
 
Spent time the other day deburring the crankshaft, the Subaru rods are are same length as the 2.8 with a 2mm smaller rod journal. The plan is to offset grind the crank to 2.77" stroke. The rod journal will be widened .030" and set on the low side of the spec to achieve .002" rod bearing clearance and we can get a 3/32 radius.. Mains will be set on the split of the tolerance and ground .010" under, with .0025" bearing clearance.

The block got honed .020" over and I'll pick that up tomorrow.

As of now our dimensions are 3.681" 93.5mm bore and 2.77" 70.35mm stroke for a grand total of 2894cc
 
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Yeah, I can get something up here. The crank was sent to the grinders, I'll be picking up the block at lunch and I have the rods.
 
No pics yet. I spent some time this afternoon making port molds of the all the ports so I can show you guys what they all look like.
The block was picked up Friday, power honing the cylinders .020" over has gotten expensive.
Sent the specs off for the crank grind 2.77 stroke, low side on the rod journals, and .0002" over the split on the main journals. Widen rod journals .030".
Working up the piston sheet for the pistons. AutoTec 4032 Forging .0035"-.004" clearance. The .906" Subaru wrist pins arent easy to get so we are going to use .912" SBF Ford wrist pins. Honing the rod bushing .006" is an easy day. Ring package will consist 1.0-1.2-2.8 rings this will be a very nice upgrade. The stock piston rings look like something from an International Harvester.
Compression Ht. of 1.560" should give me a "0" deck which will improve combustion efficiency greatly.
Target compression will be 10.2:1.
Give me a day or two and we'll post up some footage of what is going on.

I'm thinking of doing a review of the 200hp article that was posted up. 40 years have past, were shooting for the same power but less compression and a smaller camshaft so we need to up our game on the cylinder heads and use some of the modern day technology to build 200hp engine with good street manners.
 
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I'm building a Alpine with the 2.8 cologne engine from a 1984 bronco. My question is what crankshaft dampener and pulley system are you running for AC. I'm not having any luck with the part numbers Dan Richardson Gives in the conversion documentary.
 
A/C wasn't a part of the plan on this build. You're not having any luck making his part numbers work, or you can't find those part numbers.
 
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I'm building a Alpine with the 2.8 cologne engine from a 1984 bronco. My question is what crankshaft dampener and pulley system are you running for AC. I'm not having any luck with the part numbers Dan Richardson Gives in the conversion documentary.


You are building a street rod. Like most (maybe all) street rods, you are going to have to figure some things out without having an assembly line build sheet. Prowl the wrecking yards looking for stuff that may work. A tape measure, some pictures and a lot of imagination are part of the process as is having to go back and do things over when they don't work.
 
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