• Welcome to the new SAOCA website. Already a member? Simply click Log In/Sign Up up and to the right and use your same username and password from the old site. If you've forgotten your password, please send an email to membership@sunbeamalpine.org for assistance.

    If you're new here, click Log In/Sign Up and enter your information. We'll approve your account as quickly as possible, typically in about 24 hours. If it takes longer, you were probably caught in our spam/scam filter.

    Enjoy.

Adjusting Self-Adjusting Brakes

Shannon Boal

Platinum Level Sponsor
If the "stubs" (right angle brackets, attached to inboard side of backing plate, upon which torsional coil parking brake lever return springs mount) are bent, not a ninety degree bracket; the springs will be loose. Look at the brackets.......
 

Jay Laifman

Donation Time
Well, too much of a good thing, I guess. I installed the new springs and the new cable. They now tighten perfectly. So perfect that they are now too tight. Need to go back now and figure out why that is. More to follow.
 

Jay Laifman

Donation Time
No good answer. I pulled/bent the lever out a bit to reduce the duration that the lever pushes the adjuster. Seems to help a little, but not enough yet.
 

Shannon Boal

Platinum Level Sponsor
When I finally got all the bugs out of my series V brake self-adjusters, I concluded that they were not capable of adjusting themselves too tight. Then I started having trouble with the left rear dragging. It got worse. I could not figure out why, but learned that I could open the brake bleeder valve and free up the wheel. It was the rear brake hose......not the self-adjuster at all.
 

Gordon Holsinger

Diamond Level Sponsor
When I finally got all the bugs out of my series V brake self-adjusters, I concluded that they were not capable of adjusting themselves too tight. Then I started having trouble with the left rear dragging. It got worse. I could not figure out why, but learned that I could open the brake bleeder valve and free up the wheel. It was the rear brake hose......not the self-adjuster at all.
The self adjusting brakes were/are a real pain to work on My adjusters we’re shot so I went on an internet hunt found all of the new parts and installed them. They require careful attention at least every few thousand miles!
 

Jay Laifman

Donation Time
So I'm a bit perplexed. I pulled apart the brakes today. One side was tightened fine. The other side was too tight. This was after I put in new springs and new cable. The side that was tightened fine had actually lost both of the C clips that hold it in. The side that was too tight still had one.

I videoed them working when the drum was off and the parking brake was pulled. The side with no clips, that tightens fine, the slave definitely lifted up when the cable was pulled. The side with on clip moved a little, but not much.

I can get new clips and secure it down. But seeing them in action, I think all that will accomplish is to make the side that WASN'T too tight become too tight!

I'm thinking about going to non-self adjusting brakes. Someone I know does have a rear end I can pull the baking plates off of. But I'd still rather get these working better if I could.
 

Shannon Boal

Platinum Level Sponsor
These "c-clips" would be the wheel cylinder retaining hardware?
The side that was tightened fine had actually lost both of the C clips that hold it in. The side that was too tight still had one.

I videoed them working when the drum was off and the parking brake was pulled. The side with no clips, that tightens fine, the slave definitely lifted up when the cable was pulled. The side with on clip moved a little, but not much.

I can get new clips and secure it down. But seeing them in action, I think all that will accomplish is to make the side that WASN'T too tight become too tight!

I'm thinking about going to non-self adjusting brakes. Someone I know does have a rear end I can pull the baking plates off of. But I'd still rather get these working better if I could.[/QUOTE]
 

Jay Laifman

Donation Time
I watched the mechanism work, trying to figure out why it is over tightening.

The lever slides down, like it should.
Then when the handbrake is pulled, the lever pushes the star wheel up until it has rotated enough that the lever slips off. (Think of the star as a clock, and the lever is pointing up at about 7:00. When the star rotates to close to 9:00, the flat of the star is now pulling away, and the lever slips off).

It seems to me that the tightness of the mechanism is all dictated by when the lever slips off. I'm really not seeing anything that can be changed to cause it to slip sooner - except to have worn out stars!

Is there a chance that there are different size star wheels out there? (I know the self adjusting star is different than the non-self adjusting star. I mean are there different self adjusting stars? I've just emailed Rick to see).
 
Last edited:

puff4

Platinum Level Sponsor
I don't have a good answer to your questions, Jay, save to say that I've only seen one size or type of star wheel, and I've never worn one out. The star wheels I believe originally were made with somewhat rounded teeth.

One thing I do know... it's critical to use some grease - I recommend white lithium grease - on the sliding contact surfaces of the wheel cylinder and the innermost of the cylinder's retaining clips. This allows the cylinder to slide freely and enhances the ability of the mechanism to work properly. I use the same lube on the threads of the star wheel assembly and also a small dab at each of the shoe contact points on the backing plate.
 

Gordon Holsinger

Diamond Level Sponsor
I don't have a good answer to your questions, Jay, save to say that I've only seen one size or type of star wheel, and I've never worn one out. The star wheels I believe originally were made with somewhat rounded teeth.

One thing I do know... it's critical to use some grease - I recommend white lithium grease - on the sliding contact surfaces of the wheel cylinder and the innermost of the cylinder's retaining clips. This allows the cylinder to slide freely and enhances the ability of the mechanism to work properly. I use the same lube on the threads of the star wheel assembly and also a small dab at each of the shoe contact points on the backing plate.
I O H the brakes on my SV I replaced the star self adjusters on both sides I got the parts from Guestie’s garage they are on the web he deals with MGC’s. I assembled everything with lithium grease. These brakes require periodic maintenance I would suggest 10 k miles or yearly.
 

Shannon Boal

Platinum Level Sponsor
The wheel that is too tight, which side is it? My mystery tight brake was driver's side (USA) .
Now we have the mountings of the wheel cylinders to consider..... The end result must be no wobble, but free sliding movement in the slot. I had to stone burrs off the clips, (the clips tend to dig into the backing plate, and the grooves in the wheel cylinder differ in size). One brake was perfectly smooth in that regard, the other was OK. I could move one with thumb pressure, the other a little tighter.
On to star wheels....yes to clean tooth shape and free moving lubrication. I had to correct the fit of the bores in the wheel cylinder into which the star wheels fit. One was too tight, and I scraped it to fit with a small knife. One was too loose, and the wheel would rock sideways away from the lever. I shimmed it with material from a beverage can, wound carefully into the hole.
I found that my left-rear brake would still drag but was properly adjusted.....if I opened the bleed valve, the wheel would free up. While both wheels are fed from the same offending flex hose, only the left would drag like hell, the right one never did. I never did find out why.
I also learned, after having conquered the Kilimanjaro of self-adjuster problems, that the best solution seems to be: "Dan's Rear Discs".....though a discussion of hub-removal technique is involved.
 

Jay Laifman

Donation Time
I don't know if this is a good follow up. I've given up. I think this may be a first for me. I even had the non-self adjusting parts ready to swap back in. But then I actually gave up on that too. I ordered rear disc brakes. I'm excited about them - and I recognize that for my uses, drums are fine. But, more on the disc conversion on other threads.
 

DanR

Diamond Level Sponsor
Jay, Two USPS Priority Flat Rate boxes go out Monday to be followed by one with the E-Brake Rod in a day or so.
 

Shannon Boal

Platinum Level Sponsor
" I've given up. I think this may be a first for me. I even had the non-self adjusting parts ready to swap back in. But then I actually gave up on that too. I ordered rear disc brakes. "
I think you did the right thing.....the next tricky bit is popping off the hubs. I like the suggestion of winding the puller up tight and resting a big soldering iron on it for a while. The Brits say it pops in 20-40 minutes that way
 

sunalp

Diamond Level Sponsor
I've had the rear disks on my car for over a year now and I have to say they're great! Much more positive
braking with no maintenance. Easy to install as well. Dan sells a great alternative to the rear drums!
 
Top