Why aren't people doing a 2.9 V6 swap?

[260Alpine]

Dan's mounts and 4.0 headers will swap a 2.9 V6 in. There are probably more of those motors than the 2.8. You would have to figure out the radiator to pulleys room. This thread has info on carb and distributor swaps:

2.9 V6 info | SAOCA Forum (sunbeamalpine.org)

 

[Dillon65]

There is company in Europe that makes a conversion plate to mount an early 2.8 timing cover onto a 2.9 block. You have to drill a few holes in the block and tap to mount the plate to the 2.9 block, but it looks straight forward. Unfortunately, the downloadable instructions are in German only. Then you can use the shorter water pump. Here is the link. They also sell other high performance stuff for these engines.

https://www.shop-fordv6.de/product_...dapter-timing-gear-cover-to-2-9i-blocks.htmld.

 

[Dillon65]

Also since the fuel injection unit on the 2.9 is to tall to fit under an Alpine hood, Burton Power in the UK offers a triple DCNF weber manifold for the 2.9. Or you can use the stock 2.9 fuel rail unit with 3 Jenvey DCNF throttle bodies (TB). The Jenvey company offers these TB with or without fuel injector holes.
Since the 2.9 already has a fuel rail and injectors into the stock manifold base, have aluminum adapter plates made to transition from the round throttle plates at the bottom of the Jenvey TB to the square input ports of the stock 2.9 manifold base. The jenvey TB are very short.

 

[260Alpine]

Dillon, Good find! maybe a local machine shop could make the timing cover adapter. Then the front would be the same as the 2.8. Too bad the 2.8 timing cover is cast iron instead of aluminum.

 

[DanR]

I wish to thank Dillon65 (Lee) for this excellent bit of information on the 2.8 - 2.9 V6.

I have spent all sorts of hours trying to figure a way (s) to utilize a 2.9 (4.0 OHV V6) in our Alpines.

The Cologne V6 (2.8, 2.9 and 4.0 are basically the SAME engine. Very little external differences.

However, those few external differences are MAJOR stumbling blocks when it comes to adopting the different engines into the Alpine.

Some of them are:

Exhaust port arrangement - Figured this one out with my new 4.0 headers

Water Pump differences - Modified the 2.8 water pump successfully except on emergency breakdowns away from home.

Timing cover differences - Dillon65's New info may be the answer !

Fuel delivery differences - Biggie problem (for me). MicroSquirt or 4BBL intake can be the cure.

Electronic differences - I'm plumb dumb

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Now, with this new information on the timing cover I will head to my Draftsman/Laser Buddy

 

[Reg from Canada]

Could an electric fan be used so that you would have enough room for the extra length. If the fan was not installed and an electric added to front of rad would that work

 

[Dillon65]

Actually, Weslake of UK make an aluminum 2.8 v6 timing cover. I do not know of if it is early or late 2.8 v6 design.

 

[Dillon65]

There are many companies offer 9 -10 inch electric fans. You mount 2 side by side with a shroud and you will more than cool the engine.

 

[DanR]

I have tried all sorts of ways to utilize an electric fan or fans in conjunction with the 2.9 and 4.0 water pumps with or without the stock fan. The snouts are longer than the Mutt II by 1 and 1/4" in length. The 2.9/4.0 snouts are the obstacles.

Then when you install the pulley, its design takes up more space.

The mount for the radiator can be "cut out" and "modified" but then the hood and hinges become another obstacle to overcome.

Not saying it can't be done, just beware there will be some metal removal from the structure of your Alpine. I've had to set the radiator at an angle, the bottom being pushed forward, adding two 10" fans on each side of the radiator allowing clearance for the pulley and belt (s).

 

[Alpine 1789]

I don't know if this will be applicable, but I am fairly certain Jim Ellis machined a Ranger 2.8 timing cover and water pump to fit. I assume that is different from the 2.9 cover, but the process may be the same. Unfortunately, I searched the forum and all I could find was this discussion from 2009: https://forum.sunbeamalpine.org/index.php?threads/using-the-ranger-timing-cover.12465/#post-81607. This looks to be before he actually did it. I will look though my correspondence with Jim to see if he told me about it in writing. But, maybe this will trigger a memory for someone else.

 

[DanR]

I keep getting questions on the various V6 engine options for the Alpine. Here are some comments that my be of help to those that my be interested in doing a conversion.

Over the course of four years I have worked to install the 4.0 V6 OHV Engine in one of my Alpines.

A. Basic trouble (s) are:
1. The water pump is longer by about 1 1/4" than the Mutt II
2. The Fuel system is EFI (stock) and sits very high out front so the hood "must" have a scoop and it then looks ugly (very high 2 to 3").
3. There are no known headers available on the market for the 4.0 OHV V6 to work in an Alpine. (See para C. 2. below).
4. Electric system: Distributor or Computer type?

B. Possibilities:
1. Modify the shroud that holds the radiator. Various means can be applied that would allow extending the radiator away from the engine. Run an electric fan (pusher/puller).
2. Notch the crossmember to allow a bit more clearance for the harmonic balancer.
3. Have a set of headers designed and fabricated tor the 4.0 OHV V6 in an Alpine.
4. Design, or buy a fuel system for the 4.0 OHV V6 whether a carb type engine or FI. Folks have discussed a MICROSquirt, a 4BBL and utilizing the stock system.

C. What I have done thus far:
1. Utilized: My crosslink, transmission mounts, and engine mounts (some cases modified engine mounts slightly).
2. Designed and built: A set of headers (Straightback) similar to the Tiger system for the 4.0 OHV V6 installed in the Alpine.
3. Attempted: To get a MicroSquirt design and/or a 4bbl intake built for the 4.0 OHV V6.
4. Bolted the 4.0 OHV V6: To a Mustang T5 utilizing a Mutt II Bellhousing and to an A4LD automatic (O/D).

D. Plans:
1. To continue with the installation as time permits.
2. Find a Fabricator for my 4.0 OHV V6 Straightback headers.
3. Press for the MicroSquirt Fuel System as a priority. Keep the 4BBL Intake fabrication going.
4. Have available the Engine Mounts and Transmission Mounts if and when they are needed.
5. Continue with the currently best option for converting the Alpine utilizing the FORD 2.8 V6 (Cologne Engine). DanR

 

[Bill Blue]

Dan, I'm surprised you listed the 4.0 intake as a trouble spot. I thought you had found a way to get the proper hood clearance.
Bill

 

[DanR]

Dan, I'm surprised you listed the 4.0 intake as a trouble spot. I thought you had found a way to get the proper hood clearance.
Bill

The stock FI is still a bit of a problem to me, until I can get the MicroSquirt developed.

As you know, The Red GT is finally being put back together after a long, long period of paint troubles. Hoping to sit the engine back in soon. Then I will know for sure what hood modification? or header modifications I will need if any. Been a long time awaiting the paint job. Finished doing all of the needed buffing yesterday except some on the trunk lid. Next, I'll put the front and rear suspension back underneath. I'll try doing it and the engine from the bottom for the first time

 

[260Alpine]

Dan, May be easier to use a Holley sniper in place of the original throttle body. This is on a MGB:

Ceres Motorsports on Instagram: “Our fuel injected MGB is coming together nicely. Our setup will help the car run smoothly and efficiently whether the engine is cold or the…”

Not much more than a carb:

Factory Refurbished - Sniper EFI - Holley

They make a one barrel now that would work for 4 cylinder motors:

Holley Sniper EFI 550-552 Holley Sniper EFI Autolite 1100 - Gold

 

[DanR]

Bill, Jim, Here's a PIC of the FI with my latest adjustments. Not too bad! With the contour of the Alpine hood with the FI Sticking out right at 2".

 

[DanR]

Tight fit ! But, enough clearance between the headers and steering box. .

 

[DanR]

Read the numbers! Not much if you consider the radiator & a fan whether manual or electric.

 

[DanR]

Here is the 4.0 with the radiator mount cut out and a new larger radiator installed, sitting at an angle (the bottom pushed forward) with two 11" puller fans.

NOTE: A pulley is not yet bolted in place. It will bolt in but it too is very tight.

The top of the radiator is pushed underneath the frame support as far as I could push it. The Hood/Bonnet hinges are situated in such a fashion that they are near touching the top of the radiator.....

 

[260Alpine]

Dan, Great work!

 

[Bill Blue]

Dan, what do you mean "With the contour of the Alpine hood it's right t 2"?" Two inches of clearance or lacks 2"? Have you placed the orange hood on the car?
Bill