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Weber conversion

napa 1

Donation Time
Even though the expansion tank looks cool, I converted to the later series style set-up without the tank for a cleaner look. Most of the tanks are corroded anyway. To do this you need the later style thermostat housing, radiator and sensor.


The expansion tank is just so darn cute and funky, I'm going to keep it. Mine appears to be in pretty good shape and should clean up nicely. I've removed the unit, as you suggested, so as to be able to put the PB Oil on the bottom threads of the bolt. I'm going to be patient and carefull until I get those bolts removed.
 

Nickodell

Donation Time
Nickodell - I'm interested in your jetting recomendations. Can you post either here or in a new topic? I think a lot of us would be interested!

Hi, Andy. I posted my own method last month but that was in the old forum. Basically, the so-called "idle" jet as fitted, which also controls the mixture in progression when starting from idle, in many of the Webers as delivered does not suit the Alpine engine. So you get a momentary leaning-out of the mixture until the engine speeds up, resulting in a stumble, or bogging down. In extreme cases the engine will stall on you, which can be a killer. You often won't notice this by blipping the throttle in neutral, it only happens when the engine is under load, i.e. when starting from rest.

Now you can play around by buying a series of increasingly larger jets, but being a skinflint I "did it my waaaaay." I happened to have a set of very small drills which I use in my model railroading hobby. By very small, I mean the smallest are hard to see. For example, the largest one you can see here is 0.036" (36 thou, or 0.91mm), the smallest (which you can't) is 0.013" (0.33mm). You need this kind of set, as each drill increases by no more than 0.003"," or three thou. You won't find them at Pep Boys or Sears Hardware; you need a hobby shop, especially one that deals with micro-modelers like railroaders who scratch-build locos, or maybe a specialty tool supplier.
Micro-drills.jpg
(Sorry about the poor image. Cheap digital camera that I keep meaning to replace).

You also need a micro-chuck drill. Power is neither necessary or possible, so the drill you use is a one-hand little device with a spiral body (looks like a Lilliputian Bendix drive) and finger pad. You also need patience, as you will need to bore several times in 3 thou increments to get the right result.

Anyhow, I kept boring the jet out and noting that the stumble got progressively less until, at 0.031" (31 thou, or 0.79mm) it disappeared altogether. I went to the next drill, 0.034 (0.86mm) just to err on the safe (richer) side as I reckoned it might need it on a cold start in winter (not that we've had a winter here yet: 60 deg. F again today).

If you go this way, be sure you blow out the jet to remove any drillings before reinstalling, natch.
 

Drnobeam

Donation Time
Yes, I do remember reading your post from the previous forum. Good stuff, and worth the effort to get it right. Nice that the carb top removes so easily on the DGV. I wonder if we could find a matching new idle/pilot jet from a DGV parts supplier from your spec of 0.79 to 0.86mm? Are you running a 1592 or a 1725 engine?

It was a toasty 33 degrees F this morning heading to work, here in So. California! :eek:
 

Wombat

Donation Time
John

I have a nasty feeling in my bones that the whole length of the bolts are corroded to the the inside of the hole in the header tank they go through. I had a similar problem when I tried to remove the thermostat housing from the head of my SIV. I eventually destroyed the housing (The head needed to be exchanged) trying to take it off.

It appears that over time water seeps into the narrow space between the bolts (or studs) and corrodes the alloy and sticks the two firmly together. Let the penetrating oil do its stuff and when you reassemble, use some form of anti-sieze. Can't make any definite recommendations, but I am thinking silicone grease. I will bow to better knowledge here, this is another problem I will need to resolve.
 

napa 1

Donation Time
Thanks for the info, Robert. I'm going to take it slow and steady to get those bolts out. I was just hoping to pop a new thermostat in while I have everything apart...but if it proves to be impossible, I'll leave it together and just worry about it if/when the thermo gives out in the future. I don't know what the life expectancy of a thermostat is.
 

Pumpkin

Donation Time
stuck nuts or bolts

Many years ago I had some rusty stuck head bolts on my 41 Ply. The way we did it" removed" was to take a battery charger, (MAKE sure to disconect your battery) put one clamp on the engine and the other on the bolt head, now turn it on in the highest mode and wait for it all to heat up inside the threads, now that being said, this was on a iron head not an aluminum one. Also we had a vise grip on the bolt and put on pressure.
These day you might use a weldor,,same deal except more power.

You may want to wear a goggle also ,, of course in the olden days we didn't even know what those were.

In the recent past I have used a weldor to thaw out pipes and know that works. No not plastic... and much caution on copper pipes.

Now I just if possible drill out and use a reversing easy out, and some mild heat..
Instead of WD-40 use a kerosene or diesel for the lubricant, they tend to soak in well over night, the lighter wd kinda slips off.
My 2.587p
Chuck Ore.
 

Nickodell

Donation Time
Yes, I do remember reading your post from the previous forum. Good stuff, and worth the effort to get it right. Nice that the carb top removes so easily on the DGV. I wonder if we could find a matching new idle/pilot jet from a DGV parts supplier from your spec of 0.79 to 0.86mm? Are you running a 1592 or a 1725 engine?:
Andy: you don't have to remove the carb top on a DGV to change the idle jet. It's conveniently on the LHS of the carb; just need a screwdriver. My car is an SV, stock 1725 bored 60 over.
 

Drnobeam

Donation Time
I used my carb straight as jetted for a 1600cc engine from Sunbeam Specialties. It does have a slight flat spot off idle and it's nice to know it's easily curred by fattening the idle jet.

Thanks for the tip.
 

Wombat

Donation Time
Would this flat spot problem be an idle jet problem or someting related to the progression holes or accelerator pump/jet? The bigger idle jet sounds like the easier fix but does it make the engine run rich a low load?

Random thoughts.
 

64beam

Donation Time
Would this flat spot problem be an idle jet problem or someting related to the progression holes or accelerator pump/jet? The bigger idle jet sounds like the easier fix but does it make the engine run rich a low load?

Random thoughts.

Hi Robert,

I think the problem may be in your accelerator pump or progression holes. At this stage, I would try and get your hands on a slightly larger pump jet. If the flat spot is higher in the rev range you may need to look at your progression holes.

Just a few random thoughts,

Regards, Robin.
 

Nickodell

Donation Time
I don't know about the progression jet(s), but I eliminated an accelerator pump problem right at the start. First I exercised the pump and checked that it was in fact discharging into the choke. I then rigged the pump operating lever so that it would move the moment you moved the accelerator pedal (i.e. throttle spindle) instead of the designed clearance, but it made no difference so I set the gap back to the original setting. All I can say is that steadily increasing the idle jet in 3 thou steps cured the problem once and for all and I don't get an over-rich idling problem.
 

Pumpkin

Donation Time
linkage

One of the guys in our group made a fitting and mounted a VW cable system for his Weber. I did have some pics but it is a basic thing .
Chuck in Oregon
 

Maebnus

Donation Time
Hey Andy or whomever else has the fore mentioned Webber carb. I recently installed the hop up kit (sync-link) on this carb. Ever since then It has been tough to lower the idle, I'm idling around 12 and its tuff on colder mornings. I make up for it big time on the other end but is it common to have difficulty setting the idle? Need i mention at the same time i changed over from points to a Crane ignition system. Thanks in advance.
 

Nickodell

Donation Time
Something is preventing the throttle spindle from closing to the idle setting, or you need to reset the idle speed screw. Check the linkage.
 

Bill Blue

Platinum Level Sponsor
I think Nick has it with the sync link. Sounds like it eliminates throttle plate progression and locks the plates together. If so, I'd guess that one plate is fully closed and the other is opened slightly.

Bill
 

Drnobeam

Donation Time
Andy: you don't have to remove the carb top on a DGV to change the idle jet. It's conveniently on the LHS of the carb; just need a screwdriver. My car is an SV, stock 1725 bored 60 over.

This one's for Nick, I removed both idle jets from the top of the carb and then ordered a small drill set #60 through #80. Which of the two idle jets are you modifying? Looking at the throttle linkage which side are we talking 'bout (there is an idle jet on each side of the carb)?

Thanks for your help!
 

Nickodell

Donation Time
Looking at the carb from the driver's side, the primary idle jet is the one toward the front of the car, i.e. on the left. The one on the passenger side is the secondary idle jet. I only increased the bore of the primary one, so I can't advise on what effect working on both would have.
 

Bill Tubbs

Donation Time
Weber linkage photos

Andy,

I found your webshots site via a Google search and didn't realize you posted the info here. Is it possible you could email me those linkage photos of your setup? Webshots won't let me download them and I need all the help I can get when I start to tackle putting my 28/36 on board. I keep hearing about linkage kits which, without photos of individual installations, would be a lot easier for me to deal with.

Thanks!
Bill
 
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