Hartwell modified Head and Intake manifold?

[bernd_st]

Ok let's follow up by PM then...

P.S. Currently out of accelerator spindles. Here is how the choke looks vs. throttle:

 

[alpine_64]

I have a new straight runner weber inlet that i bought in sweeden about 14 years ago, i was going to use it to replace the the redline manifold i use so i could refit the stock scuttle brace on the left side.. But then realised the holbay extended auxiliary venturis and velocity stacks wouldn't clear down that low... So i stayed with the redline one and the other went into the parts cave...

 

[alpine_64]

Give the Hartwell inlet and the Zenith's a good glass blast/cleaning. Then get the Zenith's overhauled (can help you) and run them. You won't be first notch but at least you'll run in period style

Just my 2 cent, didn't Zenith's win the thermal efficiency award @ LeMans?

Hey bernd... Dcoes are period style.. Remember the factory cars ran them in '63.. The most powerful 1600 they ran in period with more agressive cams and head work.... But sadly not reliable at LM.. Yet held together well later on the Tour De France event.

The Zeniths were used in 61 and 62 as they were the standard carb and at that point the only homologated ones.

 

[Limey]

I have a new straight runner weber inlet that i bought in sweeden about 14 years ago, i was going to use it to replace the the redline manifold i use so i could refit the stock scuttle brace on the left side.. But then realised the holbay extended auxiliary venturis and velocity stacks wouldn't clear down that low... So i stayed with the redline one and the other went into the parts cave...

Hi Michael, Id be interested in buying it if you have a mind to sell it?
Let me know
Cheers
Oliver

 

[alpine_64]

Oliver,

LYNX sell several manifolds, including the gooseneck style, but not a straight one:

http://www.lynxauto.com.au/lynx-manifolds/sunbeam.html

Redline also sell a gooseneck but no straight shot:

https://www.redlineauto.com.au/p-136-redline-12-3040-manifold-inlet-fit-sunbeam-alpine-2xdcoe.aspx

Ill drop you an e-mail

 

[Alpine 1789]

I recently saw a reference to someone milling the face of a H120 manifold to change the angle for a Series engine, rather than cutting and re-welding the runners. As I recall, this was on eBay from someone selling a manifold, so I have no faith in that. Still, it would be an easier way to go. Does anyone know if that is possible?

 

[Limey]

I've seen pics of this. It looked perfectly workable but went a bit thin. Could result in leakage but maybe not..

 

[65beam]

I recently saw a reference to someone milling the face of a H120 manifold to change the angle for a Series engine, rather than cutting and re-welding the runners. As I recall, this was on eBay from someone selling a manifold, so I have no faith in that. Still, it would be an easier way to go. Does anyone know if that is possible?

The problem with the ports would still remain.

 

[Limey]

Nothing that can't be machined?

 

[jdoclogan]

This thread was intended to be about Hartwell tuning and we all got focused on carburetors and intake manifolds. All good, as all exchanges advance understandings.

The Weber manifold on my HLM has the cast marking MR2020.


That manifold has about a 5 degree upward angle.

The intake runners are the same length as the Holbay/Arrow manifold. The Webers I put on the HLM were NOS Italian DOCE 38s. The 38s are just fine with my HLM's engine setup for street and light track/parade use.

I moved up the original fender mount and did a compound angle modification on the fender brace. This provided sufficient, albeit tight, clearance.


It will be significantly easier to fit the RHD #41 with a Weber setup.

Still, the brace will need modification. This time I may just make the common bowed modification. Thus, leaving the fender mount in it's original position. I can then change out the fender brace when running original Zeniths.

Of historical note: Both my HLM and#41 first appeared to the American public at the 1962 Sebring race. The original #41 Sebring Alpine Zeniths have seen better days. My original HLM Zeniths look to be in very good condition. I will move forward with rebuild on the latter Zeniths. Any best kit or component information is welcomed.

Wow, Jim your comment was exactly what I determined during my musing over the Holbay/Weber intake manifold this morning. Porting the intake orifices by 1mm would not be a big deal. Mmmm I think I have another project brewing.

Michael, I agree about the use of 40 DOCE Webers as time period correct as they were a factory option available through Hartwell during 62-63.....

 

[alpine_64]

I recently saw a reference to someone milling the face of a H120 manifold to change the angle for a Series engine, rather than cutting and re-welding the runners. As I recall, this was on eBay from someone selling a manifold, so I have no faith in that. Still, it would be an easier way to go. Does anyone know if that is possible?

Hi jim, I've seen a hunter single 45dcoe manifold modified to fit alpine... Twice.
Firstly it was machined as you discuss, the flange was very thin and the owner had issues with the weight of only a single 45dcoe pulling the manifold from the head causing vac leaks.
Later he had a flange cut from a zenith manifold aluminium welded on to give a stronger mating face.

 

[jdoclogan]

Originally when I got the Holbay/Arrow manifold my thinking was: When the time comes I most likely will figure out a modification knowing I already have the Weber mounting face. Michael, what you described was more along the lines at the time of purchase. However, I wasn't thinking of the 5 degree uplift until now. I need to allow time to provide me with the all too valuable cognitive fermentation. No rush, as I have plenty of facets to the #41 project to work on.