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H-Beam Racing rods

jdoclogan

Platinum Level Sponsor
Over the last few months I've spent many hours researching the engine build for the #41 Sebring Alpine. Starting with Jan Servaites' articles in The Alpine Marque, issues 7 and 14 (found on this site) to Jerry Titus' 1962 Sports car Graphics articles Project Sunbeam. Having found a performance engine builder close by setting out to find components became imperative. Today an internet pursuit provided me with access to the often mentioned Chevy rod. This is what I found:

https://www.eaglerod.com/index.php?option=com_frontpage&Itemid=1 was the apparent supplier of the part I wanted (H-beam racing rods).

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Note: the part number for the Chevy rod, above, is the same as the Pinto rod, below, except for the -6 on the end of the Chevy rod number. They are the same measurements. The pricing per unit is the same=$133.33

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Looking further into the internet I found the following:


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These price out at $89.47 each.

Looks like the ones to buy!!
 

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RootesRacer

Donation Time
Words of warning here, better find out the minimum bore size for those rods to be able to slide down during assembly.

One of the chevy rod conversion steps is to grind the big ends down so you can assemble the engine.
You probably dont want to do that to such nice rods.

My race 1725 has rods that are too big to slide down the bores, what do you think I have to do to put the motor together?
 

RootesRacer

Donation Time
Did you put the pistons and rods in from the bottom first before securing the Crank?

Close, but Sadly, the pistons cant clear the main bearing saddles..
Put the pistons in the bore at 45° push them through the bores till the pistons pin hole clears the inside of the crankcase. Install pin (with teflon buttons to keep the pin centered).
Rotate piston and rod.
Repeat 3X.
 

alpine_64

Donation Time
Just saw this after a chat with jerry.. Jartif iirc you had to clearance the block for the nuts on your crower rods?

I spoke to jerry re the toyota supra rods which are almost the same size as stock 1725 rods and come in many aftermarket options.. Im figuring there may be a 4age or similar toyota 4cyl that shares them.

Dan W was talking about triumph gt6 rods recently.... A rabbit hole of options once we start machining things to fit.
 

RootesRacer

Donation Time
I was on ebay the other day and saw chevy 294 6 cyl 4340 H Beam rods in both 5.7 and 6" C2C for low 200s (that's for 6 rods). These and all other
L6 chevy rods need narrowed .050" for the rootes engine, but thats easily done at a machine shop.
I have 6" crower sportsmans which are a pretty good rods, but I am seriously thinking of getting a set of these H beams.
I'll weight mine (or just look up the weights off the crower website) and if the H beams are lighter, I may just buy one and a half sets.
 

Dillon65

Donation Time
There is a company in the UK that makes H beam rods for alpines wms-racing.com
The size is 142.88x57.70x23.82. Thats about 5.625 inches long. Cost is 290.00 pounds or about 390.00 dollars. Currently out of stock, but they might make some if there is interest. With the size of these rods would machining need to be done to fit the alpine block? I ordered a set for my 2.8 v6. Very good looking and balancing was perfect. Just thought I pass this info on.
 

alpine_64

Donation Time
There is a company in the UK that makes H beam rods for alpines wms-racing.com
The size is 142.88x57.70x23.82. Thats about 5.625 inches long. Cost is 290.00 pounds or about 390.00 dollars. Currently out of stock, but they might make some if there is interest. With the size of these rods would machining need to be done to fit the alpine block? I ordered a set for my 2.8 v6. Very good looking and balancing was perfect. Just thought I pass this info on.
Dillon, are you reffering to williams?
 

Five Reviver

Silver Level Sponsor
Yes it's Williams.
I am contemplating lightening my internals with standard stroke + bore already .060 oversized and flat top pistons.
I emailed WMS (Williams Racing) to ask whether these 'out of stock' rods could be ordered. Andy's answer is, 'Only if you want 5 set, that's the minimum order qty and I hardly sell any so would need to order 5 sets.'
So, if five of us want a set of light, strong, standard dimension rods, it's available to us.
With ARP 8740 bolts UKP 270, ARP 200 bolts UKP 290.
Any takers?
I make one, so far.
David
 

alpine_64

Donation Time
David,

I'm thinking the Toyota rods might be a better option than the williams ones as you can buy easily and lots of selection.. Also if you and another person buy 2 sets (12 rods) you have enough for 3 motors....

Also max speed do performance rods at a reasonable cost.. Lots of BMC and Triumph guys have started running them..
https://www.maxpeedingrods.co.uk/category/h-beam-connecting-rods/triumph-conrods.html

They will make custom sets for multi orders too.
 

spmdr

Diamond Level Sponsor
I have not done the math on what is the practical longest rod, but how about this for the potential of LOW reciprocating weight:

CRS6260V3D Eagle Specialty Products, Audi/VW 2.0L TSFI

**This listing is for a weight matched set of 4 rods**

Specifications:

length: 6.260 in.
rod journal: 1.8806 in.
housing bore: 1.9925 in.
pin size: 0.787 in.
big end width: 0.9870 in.
pin end width: 0.9870 in.
thickness above pin: 0.222 in.
typical weight: 615 g
 

spmdr

Diamond Level Sponsor
This is another rod I'm looking at:

CRS5806C3D Eagle Specialty Products, Chevrolet 2.3L Quad 4

Specifications:

length: 5.806 in.
rod journal: 1.889 in.
housing bore: 2.0150 in.
pin size: 0.866 in.
big end width: 1.0080 in.
pin end width: 0.8750 in.
thickness above pin: 0.200 in.
typical weight: 590 g
 

alpine_64

Donation Time
Dan,

Do you have a target rod ratio (or range) you are looking at?
And to confirm you are working on a 1725?
 

spmdr

Diamond Level Sponsor
And then this:


Mitsubishi 4G63 2nd Gen Engine

CRS-5900-MBB

DIMENSIONS
length: 5.900 in.
rod journal: 1.7710 in.
housing bore: 1.8900 in.
pin size: 0.866 in.
big end width: 1.0380 in.
pin end width: 1.0380 in.
thickness above pin: 0.200 in.
typical weight: 575g


NOTES:
7 bolt 4G63 (1993 to 2007)
 

spmdr

Diamond Level Sponsor
Michael, Yes, a 1725. But, 1600s are NOT off the table.

And , of course, with smaller crank pin sizes, strokes are open territory.

At this point, I'm leaning quite heavily to the extra long rod with the smallest piston pin.

This would yield the shortest, lightest piston and pin.

This would be MY "New school" of piston and rod direction.

I'm VERY close to pulling the trigger on the commitment of several Alpine engines

with the 6.260" rods.

This is very doable with a nominal Compression height of 1.215" (std 1725 stroke).

As far as rod/stroke ratio, there are different schools of thought to consider.

And THAT is part of the consideration.

But I'm currently going on the OLD Smoky ROT, "go as long as you can" (or something along those lines...).

DW
 

husky drvr

Platinum Level Sponsor
If comparing specs here is another possibility. Still listed @ < $500 @ Summit for a set of four.

Dodge SRT4

Manley 14010-4

Connecting Rod Length Center to Center (in.):
5.945 in.
Connecting Rod Beam Style:
H-beam
Connecting Rod Material:
Forged 4340 steel
Wrist Pin Style:
Floating
Big End Bore Diameter (in.):
2.0870 in.
Big End Width (in.):
1.015 in.
Pin End Bore Diameter:
0.867 in.
 
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spmdr

Diamond Level Sponsor
Yes, Different strokes for different Folks...

If you want the BIG cubes, the small crank pin of the 4G63 is your rod!

BUT, IF any stroke changes are in my future, I MAY DEstroke a 1725 crank!

I can't see trying to push MORE air (of bigger cubes) through the limited flow Head!


BUT, THIS is JUST my current thinking.
 

spmdr

Diamond Level Sponsor
I have decided to practice what I preach!

I have pulled the trigger on several sets of the L O N G rods!

The next step is to pick a Bore size and ring set for several sets of pistons.
 

alpine_64

Donation Time
I have decided to practice what I preach!

I have pulled the trigger on several sets of the L O N G rods!

The next step is to pick a Bore size and ring set for several sets of pistons.
I would think a metric bore size close to 0.60 would be ideal as lots of high quality rings available from the JDM market
 
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